[Date Prev][Date Next] [Thread Prev][Thread Next]
[dm-devel] Re: [Evms-devel] dm snapshot problem
- From: Kevin Corry <kevcorry us ibm com>
- To: evms-devel lists sourceforge net
- Cc: Andrew Morton <akpm osdl org>, dm-devel redhat com, linux-kernel vger kernel org
- Subject: [dm-devel] Re: [Evms-devel] dm snapshot problem
- Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 15:26:59 -0600
On Thursday 13 January 2005 12:51 am, Andrew Morton wrote:
> Kevin Corry <kevcorry us ibm com> wrote:
> > After talking with a friend with a bit more understanding of the workings
> > of the new I/O scheduler, it seems that the way this process is
> > *intended* to work is for pdflush to block once a request-queue for a
> > device fills up to a certain point. Until I/Os have been processed from
> > the full request-queue, pdflush won't be allowed to submit any new
> > requests, and everybody gets to make some forward progress.
> Not really. The VFS/VM takes quite some care to _avoid_ blocking pdflush
> on any particular disk. Because there will always be more disks than there
> are pdflush instances, and we want to keep all the disks busy.
> So what pdflush will do is to essentially operate in a polling mode.
> pdflush will circulate over all the FS-level superblocks looking for ones
> whose backing queues are not write-congested (bdi_write_congested() returns
> false). Any such superblocks will have more writes directed to them.
> After passing over all such superblocks, pdflush will go to sleep and will
> be woken by write completion activity from any queue and will then take
> another pass across the superblocks.
Thanks for the explaination, Andrew. Perhaps I simply misunderstood the info I
got about pdflush and "blocking". Obviously if there are only a few pdflush
daemons, we don't want to have one waiting indefinitely on a single device.
> > The problem is that DM doesn't use a proper request-queue in the way
> > that, say, the IDE or SCSI drivers use them. DM's goal is merely to remap
> > a given bio and send it down the stack. It doesn't generally want to
> > collect multiple bios onto a queue to process them later. But we do get
> > into situations like snapshotting where internal queueing becomes
> > necessary. So, since DM doesn't have a proper request-queue, it can't
> > force pdflush into this throttling mode. So pdflush just continually
> > submits I/Os to the snapshot-origin, all while DM is attempting to copy
> > data chunks from the origin to the snapshot and update the snapshot
> > metadata. This is why we are seeing the dm_io and dm_tio usage go into
> > the millions, since every bio submitted to DM has one of each of these.
> Some throttling is needed, yes. The ideal way to do that would be to
> arrange for a top-level bdi_write_congested() to return true. Mechanisms
> are present to pass this call down through the I/O stack.
Yes, and DM already has some handling for the bdi_write_congested() code. The
problem I see now is that only the DM core knows about this congestion info.
When it gets called on its congested_fn routine, the DM core simply looks at
each consumed lower-level device and calls bdi_congested() for that device
and combines the return codes. But I believe a lot of the congestion is being
caused by the private queues within the snapshot module, which the DM core
knows nothing about. So it seems like we'll need to add a new call into the
DM sub-modules to allow them to return TRUE if they are experiencing any
internal congestion, and combine that info with the return codes from the
Or perhaps a slightly simpler idea would be to just add an atomic counter to
the DM-device private-data to keep a count of the number of dm_io structures
currently allocated for that device, and return TRUE on the congested_fn call
when it gets above some value. This is simpler from a code standpoint, since
it means the DM core can still handle all the congestion stuff without
involving the sub-modules. But on the other hand, for simple dm-linear
devices that are effectively just a pass-through-with-offset, it seems kinda
silly to impose such an arbitrary limit when the lower-level device's
congested_fn routine would adequately handle notifying pdflush when it's
> That will help a lot. But there are probably still ways to trip it up:
> say, a tremendous direct-io write() of highmem pages, which will bypass all
> the above pagecache stuff.
> However the direct-io code itself has explicit throttling of the number of
> requests which it will put into flight, so an exploit would probably have
> to use a lot of processes operating concurrently.
If so, wouldn't that be equally true for any device, and not just DM devices?
> > So eventually we get into a state where nearly all LowMem is used up,
> > because all of these data structures are being allocated from kernel
> > memory (hence you see very little HighMem usage).
> It would be better if dm could use highmem pages for this operation.
What's the appropriate mechanism for telling the kernel to use highmem for
these structures? Each of these slabs (dm_io and dm_tio) are created with
kmem_cache_create(), and I don't see any corresponding flags in slab.h that
mention anything about highmem. Items are allocated from this slab through
mempool_alloc() with GFP_NOIO, since we're in the middle of processing I/O
requests and don't want to start new I/O in order to get memory. Would it be
proper to call mempool_alloc(pool, GFP_NOIO|__GFP_HIGHMEM)?
> > So, if my understanding of pdflush is correct (someone please correct me
> > if my explaination above is wrong), we need to be doing some sort of
> > throttling in the snapshot code when we reach a certain number of
> > internally queued bios. Such a throttling mechanism would not be
> > difficult to add. Just add a per-snapshot counter for the total number of
> > bios that are currently waiting for chunks to be copied. If this number
> > goes over some limit, simply block the thread until the number goes back
> > below the limit.
> Yes, I suspect that something like this will be needed. It probably needs
> to be a global limit, seeing that the resource which is being managed (ie:
> memory) is a global thing.
> A very easy way of doing that, which for some reason surely will turn out
> to be insufficient :( is to just use a semaphore. Initialise the semaphore
> to (say) 1000 and do a down() when a bio is allocated and do an up() when a
> bio is freed. voila: a max of 1000 bios in flight. Adjust the initial
> value of the semaphore according to the amount of lowmem in the machine.
> Calculate the amount of lowmem via
> return x.totalram - x.totalhigh;
I would hope that if we get DM's congested_fn routine working correctly (as
discussed above), then the semaphore idea ought to be unnecessary. Agreed? Do
you think the "congestion" limit should still be based on the amount of
lowmem? Some percentage of lowmem? And if so, what would be a reasonable
Thanks for the tips!
kevcorry us ibm com
[Date Prev][Date Next] [Thread Prev][Thread Next]