ATTN SELF-STYLED LIST POLICE (was RE: Mr. Day)
Michael W. Carney
michael.es.carney at sbcglobal.net
Tue Dec 7 04:49:31 UTC 2004
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
Thomas Cameron wrote:
| On Mon, 2004-12-06 at 10:42 -0500, Robert P. J. Day wrote:
|
|>On Mon, 6 Dec 2004, Shaffer Paul wrote:
|>
|>
|>>Fedora's supporters (frequent repliers to these posts) rightfully
|>>view the lesser mortals here with skepticism and disdain because
|>>they are who they are and nobody is getting paid. Fair enough.
|>
|>no, not fair. and not accurate. if you go back and read some of
|>those threads again, you'll find that newbies are not chastised simply
|>for being newbies. they're chastised for bad behaviour.
|
|
| No, they're publicly derided for being innocently ignorant of some
| archaic set of "rules" which are not really rules - just suggested best
| practice. And that's just plain wrong. That is *not* the open
| community behavior I fell in love with when I first started using Linux.
|
|
|>some examples are (god help me, i'm almost scared to type them in)
|>posting in HTML, and top posting.
|
|
| I am so freaking sick of this BULLSHIT about posting HTML and top
| posting. It would amuse me if it didn't downright disgust me that the
| ones who scream the loudest about this crap are the ones who in the next
| message will bust on some poor newbie for not using the latest version
| of package X. Guess what - if your MUA doesn't handle HTML, then SWITCH
| FREAKING MUAs!!!! It is the 21st century, for Chrissakes! If you
| *CHOOSE* to use an MUA that doesn't handle HTML, I don't wanna hear you
| bitch about it! It's YOUR choice, freaking live with it. Pine works
| great with HTML, as does Mutt with *minimal* fiddling. Oh, and so does
| Evolution, and Thunderbird, and so on. I can't think of ANY modern mail
| reader that doesn't handle HTML. If you *CHOOSE* to be some ascetic
| Ubergeek monk and use a text only MUA that doesn't handle HTML, then you
| are a dope. And if I hear another whine about "I pay for my bandwidth
| and HTML uses more of it" I'm going to puke. If you can't deal with the
| fact that new list members are GOING to make mistakes, then maybe this
| isn't the right list for you. I mean, come ON!!! The WHOLE list for
| the month of November was a whopping 14 megs.
|
| And since about, oh, my SECOND YEAR OF GRAMMAR SCHOOL I've been able to
| read a letter out of order. GET OVER IT, people! Use your freaking
| brain for once instead of going off on some poor newbie who doesn't know
| any better. All you do when you flame some poor neophyte is alienate
| him/her and make the REST OF US look bad. Let me repeat that - when you
| flame someone, they think of "those jerks on the Fedora list," not "that
| jerk Joe Blow on the Fedora list." Like it or not, you represent the
| Fedora community, and I do not appreciate you representing my community
| like an asshole.
|
|
|>when newbies do either of these (as
|>they are wont to do, not surprisingly), they are typically (and
|>politely) asked not to do it again. and that's it. they apologize
|>sometimes, they fix their mailers, they change their behaviour, and
|>everyone gets back to work. end of problem.
|
|
| So what is your excuse then for being such a jerk? There was not only
| nothing polite in your posting, but you were an out and out ass. Twice.
| The saddest thing about your behavior is that you seem proud of it! I
| can't imagine that you would speak to someone like that face-to-face.
| If you would treat a stranger like that face-to-face, I feel really
| sorry for you.
|
|
|>sadly, there is the occasional (i can't think of any other way to
|>describe them) self-absorbed, arrogant bozo who takes umbrage with
|>these rules of etiquette and initiates his own personal crusade to
|>defend either of the above.
|
|
| Sadly, there is the occasional self-absorbed, arrogant bozo who elects
| himself "list police" who attempts to make himself look somehow better
| by publicly chewing out newbies, making the whole Fedora community look
| bad.
|
|
|>with disastrous results, of course,
|>leading to the periodic flame war only because *one* *person* thinks
|>he knows better than everyone who's been a regular for years. go back
|>and check in the archives -- tell me i'm wrong.
|
|
| You're wrong. I've been in the IT industry for a decade. While I know
| there are many on this list who look at me as still wet behind the ears,
| I've been around for long enough to have seen all this crap over and
| over and over and over and over and over (have I mentioned over and
| over?) on list after list and newsgroup after newsgroup.
|
| When I was younger and less sure of myself, I admit that I tried to play
| the cool "old-timer" and did the list police thing myself. Now that I
| have (I hope) a modicum of maturity and experience, I realize that there
| are so many more important things that top/bottom/HTML posts that I just
| roll on by that crap.
|
|
|>posters here don't get flamed for being newbies or "lesser mortals".
|>they get flamed because they have no sense of courtesy, etiquette or
|>history.
|
|
| Bullshit. Posters get flamed here by people who are trying to make
| themselves look like something more than they are. Posters here get
| flamed for innocent ignorance.
|
| If you don't like something that some newbie does, educate him instead
| of publicly humiliating him. If top/HTML posting bugs you that much,
| then hey, the delete key works really well (and you should probably
| switch to decaf). Just don't use it as an excuse to try to puff
| yourself up as some sort of wizened old-timer who speaks The Truth.
|
| It's not that hard, people - use the same courtesy here that you would
| in a business meeting. Grow up, be civil. There are enough people out
| there being nasty to each other - we don't need it in here.
|
| If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all.
|
| Thomas
|
Thomas,
I couldn't have stated how I feel about this topic any better myself.
Thanks! :^)
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFBtTZb0b4qNouqSt4RArirAJ0aJBWkLXoIViQJiF+RUR02m2GAuwCfaCuS
Nwd8LjAZyovm+/6n7gYUWzE=
=hcEF
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
More information about the fedora-list
mailing list