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Log from this weeks (20080104) EPEL SIG Meeting



Reminder: Next meeting on 20080116 at 18:00 UTC

Summary will be part of this weeks report (as always)

00:00:01 <       knurd> | Hi everybody; who's around for the EPEL meeting?
00:00:01              * | knurd likes to remind everyone that the schedule for todays meeting as well as a list of all open tasks can be found on http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Schedule 
00:00:01            --- | knurd has changed the topic to: EPEL Sig meeting -- Meeting rules at http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/Schedule/MeetingGuidelines -- Init process
00:00:14 <    mmcgrath> | pong
00:00:14              * | nirik is here. 
00:00:35            --> | stahnma (Michael Stahnke)  has joined #fedora-meeting
00:00:46 <       knurd> | ohh, and happy new year everyone
00:01:03 <     EvilBob> | happy new year knurd
00:01:11              * | _blah_ can't believe it is 2008 already
00:01:17 <     stahnma> | greeting's ya'll
00:01:38            --- | knurd has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting | next testing -> stable move | knurd | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/NextTestingStableMove
00:01:40 <       nirik> | happy new year back at you all.
00:01:47              * | quaid is here
00:01:47 <       knurd> | so let's start
00:02:03 <       knurd> | I wrote to the list about $TOPIC already
00:02:16 <       knurd> | I'll prepare the next move this WE
00:02:20 <       knurd> | for EPEL4
00:02:22 <       nirik> | yeah, that sounds good. I think we should setup specific times for stable pushes.
00:02:31 <       nirik> | ie, should it be every 2 weeks? every month?
00:02:32 <       knurd> | yeah, might be a good idea
00:02:39 <       knurd> | every four weeks?
00:02:41 <       nirik> | so people know when to expect it, rather than ad-hoc
00:03:24 <       knurd> | EPEL5 early each month, EPEL4 mid each month?
00:03:29 <       nirik> | every 4 weeks sounds ok to me...
00:03:50 <       nirik> | so how long does something need to be in testing? a full 4 weeks? or ?
00:04:16 <       knurd> | at least two weeks?
00:04:25 <    mmcgrath> | <nod> a schedule.
00:05:12 <       nirik> | 2 weeks seems ok. So, around the 1st for epel5, and around the 15th for epel4?
00:05:19 <       knurd> | nirik, +1
00:05:31 <       knurd> | I'd say I write that to the list and ask for opinions
00:05:39 <       knurd> | if that's fine for everyone we just do it
00:05:48 <     stahnma> | fine with me
00:06:08 <       nirik> | fine with me. I think a regular schedule is good. Let me know if you want me to try and do any of the pushes...
00:06:16              * | knurd will move on then if no one yells
00:06:27 <       knurd> | nirik, I'll try to write down the proceedure next time
00:06:55 <       nirik> | ok, I'd be happy to help, or just let you do it. ;)
00:07:07 <       knurd> | :)
00:07:09            --- | knurd has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting | EL-updates to the buildsys | unassigned | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/Misc
00:07:25 <       knurd> | dgilmore, mmcgrath, how hard would be to realize that?
00:07:42 <    mmcgrath> | using RHEL, not sure.
00:07:42 <       knurd> | there was this build problem from remi on the list
00:07:45 <    mmcgrath> | it'd be easy with CentOS.
00:08:14 <       knurd> | https://www.redhat.com/archives/epel-devel-list/2008-January/msg00000.html
00:08:17 <    mmcgrath> | We just need to figure out a way to keep the RHEL tree updated in an easy way.
00:08:26              * | nirik suggests we switch to centos? :) 
00:08:48              * | mmcgrath one sec on the phone with IBM
00:08:50 <       knurd> | nirik, that creates just problems in the other direction
00:09:02 <       knurd> | and no support for ppc (yet)
00:09:07 <       nirik> | yeah, I suppose... ;(
00:09:18 <     stahnma> | can we just get entitlements from RH?
00:09:26 <     stahnma> | this seems like it shouldn't be THAT hard
00:09:30 <       knurd> | and people yeeling "why didn't you update to RHEL 5.2"
00:09:33 <    mmcgrath> | we have entitlements from RH but its a matter of keeping it up to date.
00:09:58 <      _blah_> | do we just fix build problems as they come up for now?
00:10:08 <       knurd> | mmcgrath, can't reposync solve the problem?
00:10:18 <    mmcgrath> | possibly.
00:10:19 <       knurd> | _blah_, until now we ignored the problem
00:10:28 <      _blah_> | knurd: :)
00:10:38 <       knurd> | _blah_, that's why I ddin#t answer yet on remi's mail
00:10:42 <    mmcgrath> | We're doing similar things in our infrastructure already.  how often would we propose running it?
00:10:42 <       nirik> | so does it require manually pulling updates and adding them to plague right now?
00:11:02 <    dgilmore> | mmcgrath: daily or weekly
00:11:03 <       knurd> | mmcgrath, a cronjob that runs once or twiecea day maybe?
00:11:18 <       knurd> | s/twiecea/twice a/
00:11:20 <    dgilmore> | knurd: certainly not more than once a day
00:11:40 <       nirik> | daily would be great.
00:11:50 <       nirik> | weekly would be ok if daily causes issues IMHO
00:11:57 <       knurd> | dgilmore, well, if we get stuff into EPEL that depends on a specific firefox then daily is a minimum
00:12:07 <       knurd> | or how is the firefox problem handled in EL?
00:12:18 <       knurd> | is there s stable firefox abi?
00:12:24 <       nirik> | I don't think rhel pushes updates more often than once a day anyhow, does it?
00:12:27            --> | awjb (Andreas Bierfert)  has joined #fedora-meeting
00:12:37 <       nirik> | no, no stable abi... it's firefox-devel like fedora.
00:12:41 <    dgilmore> | knurd: rhel is lucky to get updates weekly
00:13:03 <       knurd> | dgilmore, yeah, but if there is a new firefox we should rebuild stuff against ir quickly
00:13:14 <    dgilmore> | knurd: there is no way it should be done more than daily
00:13:18 <       nirik> | daily would be great if possible... dgilmore, could you set that up?
00:13:24 <    dgilmore> | nirik: no
00:14:02              * | Jeff_S shows up a bit late...  
00:14:06 <       nirik> | ok. :) perhaps mmcgrath could?
00:14:12 <       knurd> | who can set this up? Does anyone from us besides dgilmore and mmcgrath have access to the machines?
00:14:43 <    mmcgrath> | knurd: anyone in sysadmin-main
00:14:46 <    dgilmore> | knurd: it is not a matter of just having access
00:15:11              * | quaid senses a stronger objection
00:15:15 <       knurd> | dgilmore, --verbose?
00:15:46            --> | kital (JoergSimon)  has joined #fedora-meeting
00:16:30 <    mmcgrath> | we'd have to make sure we're getting all the various channels copying them to the right place and running the createrepo script on them.
00:16:30            --- | rdieter is now known as rdieter_away
00:16:35 <    mmcgrath> | it can all be scripted.
00:16:49 <    mmcgrath> | at least I think it can.
00:16:58 <    mmcgrath> | we also have to do bad things to get it to contact RHN properly.
00:17:50            <-- | mbacovsk has quit (Remote closed the connection)
00:18:07 <       knurd> | so, what to do?
00:18:10 <       knurd> | put it on a todo list
00:18:11 <    mmcgrath> | So the decision has been made?  "We want this to run daily?" or some such thing?
00:18:12 <       nirik> | well, the other options I see: do the updates at the same time as the stable pushes?
00:18:18 <       knurd> | put it high on the todo-list
00:18:24 <       knurd> | ignore the problem?
00:18:25 <       nirik> | or just: 'apply updates as people require them' ?
00:18:29 <    mmcgrath> | make a ticket it - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/
00:18:35            --> | mbacovsk (Martin Bacovsky)  has joined #fedora-meeting
00:18:56              * | knurd will file a ticket
00:19:04 <       knurd> | then we can see where we get from there
00:19:10 <       knurd> | that okay for everybody?
00:19:43 <       nirik> | sure. I think daily would be great, but less often would be fine too.
00:19:54 <       knurd> | nirik, yeah, for the start less often should do
00:20:00              * | knurd moves on
00:20:03            --- | knurd has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting | RHEL MetaData | stahnma | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/RhelMetaData
00:20:05 <       knurd> | stahnma ?
00:21:00 <     stahnma> | sorry
00:21:08 <     stahnma> | not much to update
00:21:14 <     stahnma> | I am working on it
00:21:21 <     stahnma> | and didn't have much time over the holidays
00:21:24 <     stahnma> | am hoping for more very soon
00:21:31 <       knurd> | k :)
00:21:38            --- | knurd has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting | KojiAndBodhiForEpel | mmcgrath | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/KojiAndBodhiForEpel
00:21:41 <       knurd> | mmcgrath, any news?
00:22:01 <    mmcgrath> | knurd: nothing over the holidays.  We're hopeful but nothing concrete yet.
00:22:06 <    dgilmore> | knurd: do the work or find someone to do it for you.  it will not happen until then
00:22:08 <       knurd> | k
00:22:22            --- | knurd has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting | permission to use spec files in other projects | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/Misc
00:22:36 <       knurd> | as written to the list: made noise about it on FAB-list
00:22:41              * | knurd skips
00:22:46            --- | knurd has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting | Free discussion around EPEL
00:22:52 <       knurd> | anything else to discuss?
00:23:28 <       knurd> | quaid, _blah_, Jeff_S, mmcgrath, nirik, anything else?
00:23:33              * | nirik has nothing else... 
00:23:39 <      Jeff_S> | not me
00:23:59              * | knurd will close the meeting in 30
00:24:02 <       quaid> | we doing anything special at FUDCon?
00:24:08              * | mmcgrath has nothing
00:24:43 <       tibbs> | I had one minor thing.
00:24:50 <       knurd> | tibbs, shoot
00:24:54 <       nirik> | it might be nice to do something at fudcon, but not sure what.
00:25:02 <       knurd> | quaid, not sure, I leave that to those guys that travel there
00:25:07 <       tibbs> | Recently there was a review for an EPEL-only package.
00:25:12 <       quaid> | we could have a hackfest with virtual folk, too
00:25:27 <       quaid> | if there is work to be done :)
00:25:34 <       tibbs> | The only real issue with that review is what to do with the devel branch.
00:25:45 <       nirik> | tibbs: I would say dead.package it.
00:26:01 <       tibbs> | Yeah, I did say that, but it only works if the package isn't supposed to be there for EPEL6.
00:26:20 <       nirik> | it shouldn't be... it's only old old rhel4 that needs it.
00:26:24 <       knurd> | tibbs, what's the #bug/reason for not having a devel branch?
00:26:37              * | knurd botes for dead.package in devel as well
00:26:41 <    dgilmore> | you can just never import into devel
00:26:58 <         f13> | knurd: the epel package may have been rolled into some other package in devel
00:27:00 <       nirik> | https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=426929
00:27:01 <     bugbot_> | Bug 426929: medium, medium, ---, Jason Tibbitts, ASSIGNED , Review Request: tetex-lineno - Add line numbers on paragraphs in LaTeX
00:27:17 <       nirik> | basically it's in tetex/texlive in all other releases.
00:27:31 <       knurd> | well, nevertheless I vote for dead.package
00:27:36 <       knurd> | scripts are used to it
00:27:36 <       tibbs> | In this case it doesn't apply to anything beyond EPEL4 but I can't say that would be the case for any future EPEL-only packages.
00:27:52 <       knurd> | better that then scripts that fail if they don#t find a devel branch at all
00:28:02 <       tibbs> | Of course, EPEL-only packages may be sufficiently rare that this isn't a real issue.
00:28:10 <       tibbs> | This is the first one I encountered.
00:28:41 <      _blah_> | is there any kind of design doc for how to implement the koji features to support EPEL?
00:29:18 <       knurd> | _blah_, taking to hte koji author as well as with dgilmore and mmcgrath might be the best start
00:29:33 <       knurd> | tibbs, agreed, should not happen often
00:29:51 <       knurd> | but what to do? I still think having a dead.package in devel is the best
00:29:55 <       nirik> | _blah_: see the ticket: https://hosted.fedoraproject.org/koji/ticket/49
00:31:24 <      _blah_> | nirik: thx
00:31:37 <       knurd> | tibbs, what was done? for the package in question
00:32:39 <       knurd> | ohh, there is a dead.package in the devel branch
00:32:46 <       knurd> | I'd say that's fine
00:33:25 <       knurd> | fudcon?
00:33:38 <       knurd> | who will be there from the EPEL SIG?
00:34:10              * | mmcgrath will be.
00:34:33              * | nirik will be there. 
00:34:38              * | knurd does not plan to fly half around the world
00:36:09 <       knurd> | nirik, quaid, mmcgrath, maybe you three can work something out for FUDCon?
00:36:46 <       nirik> | well, the one thing I can think of would be to do a 'what is epel and why I should branch my packages for it' type session...
00:37:08            <-- | mbacovsk has quit (Remote closed the connection)
00:37:13 <       knurd> | nirik, sounds good
00:37:33 <       knurd> | seems most people left
00:37:38 <       knurd> | I#d say we close the meeting
00:37:52              * | knurd will close the meeting in 30
00:37:55 <       nirik> | sounds fine.
00:38:12              * | knurd will close the meeting in 10
00:38:23 <       knurd> | -- MARK -- Meeting end
00:38:23            --- | knurd has changed the topic to: Channel is used by various Fedora groups and committees for their regular meetings | Note that meetings often get logged | For questions about using Fedora please ask in #fedora | See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/FedoraMeetingChannel for meeting schedule
00:38:28 <       knurd> | thx all
00:38:29 <    mmcgrath> | knurd: thanks!
00:38:35            --> | spoleeba (spacious he's so)  has joined #fedora-meeting
00:39:14 <       quaid> | nirik +1 to that session idea
00:39:27            --- | You're now known as knurd_afk
00:39:28 <   knurd_afk> | cu
00:39:32 <       nirik> | I guess I can add it to the wiki...
00:39:34 <       quaid> | ciao
00:39:41 <       nirik> | quaid: you going to be at fudcon?
00:43:16 <       quaid> | nirik: I plan to


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