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Re: website mockups, what is fedora?
- From: mairin linuxgrrl com
- To: "Boeckel, Benjamin" <MathStuf gmail com>, fedora-advisory-board redhat com
- Subject: Re: website mockups, what is fedora?
- Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2009 14:39:31 -0400
> On Saturday 22 August 2009 02:04:19 Máirín Duffy wrote:
>> On Sat, 2009-08-22 at 02:01 -0400, Ben Boeckel wrote:
> I think people understand that there are people who know better than them
> at something.
Yes, that doesn't mean they like to be reminded of it. If you want to
attract people you work at making them feel good, not stupid.
> Do math geniuses get pushed off to the side just because not
> everyone knows as much as them?
According to my high school experiences, yes.
>> - What happens if you have more than 4 desktop environments? How does
>> the design handle that?
> They can be put into a vertical layout instead of a grid. This can be
> decided at each release since the Editions available for that release are
> unlikely to change over the life of that release.
Which one comes first then? How do you allay concerns about this?
>> - What if I want KDE x86_64? Where do I go? These are technical people,
>> they need access to all the arches.
> Put two buttons next to each other with a link to each.
Okay, so you're going to have a grid of 8 download links plus link #9 for
the n00bs. A sea of links, just like we used to have long ago and what we
have been trying to avoid.
>> - What if (quite likely) all of the desktop environment logos clash with
>> each other and they don't all look professional?
> They'd clash in the spins page as well. I was thinking of the images used
> there, not the actual project logos. It was late, vocabulary was failing.
They wouldn't clash in the spins page because we're branding Fedora spins
with the Fedora sublogo template.
>> - What is the sidebar going to have in it? The documentation we have in
>> the sidebar in the mockups is going to be useless because it is
> The install for all of them is Anaconda, so there's no difference there.
> They both have links on the desktop (IIRC, I haven't run the KDE Live
> myself in a while). The biggest difference from the install is having to
> "customize packages" to get KDE (and to disable GNOME, which is a PITA).
That needs to be worked out.
>> - Fedora is not a menagerie of desktop environments. This makes it seem
>> as if it is. Gotta collect them all. Here is pikachu, here is.. uh,
>> toad-guy, here is giraffe guy...
> Do people see all the versions of Windows as "collectable"? This argument
> is silly. Fedora is not just GNOME either. I see no reason to be
Right now, your mockup looks like a little glass shelf where one puts
their collectibles to be gazed at. Which is confusing. Is Fedora one
thing, or is Fedora this collection of things? Do I need to download all
of these to really get it?
>> - If you're catering to people who know what they're doing, you better
>> offer a bittorrent link per spin. And an md5 sum. And a link to the gpg
>> keys to verify the packages.
> Currently there's a portal page with the "Of your download does not start
> in 5 seconds, click <here>." This information can go there.
No, that portal page was designed just for the default download. We'd need
to design a portal page, for each of the spins tailored to it. (a lot of
>> You've basically turned the design inside out. The designs I did make it
>> very easy and welcoming for newbies (where newbies != grandma), and they
>> require just one additional click from people who are already in the
>> community and feel welcome.
> It makes those looking for not-Desktop (whatever that may be, not
> specified anywhere, really needs a GNOME label on it, s/Desktop/GNOME/
> would be best IMO) feel alienated. The "one click" is small and hard to
It's really frustrating for me to hear words like "alienated" and
"demoralized" and "disenfranchised" about a web page.
Please think about WHO would be looking for a not-Desktop spin. Think
about this. Tell me how many people this is in comparison to others today.
Tell me how this can be reconciled with the requirements for this page,
which state that we are seeking to attract users who are new to Linux &
>> This design basically makes it clear that new people are not very
>> welcome - it provides a lot of choices right away, and tells the newbies
>> to go elsewhere, forcing them through 3 clicks and 3 page loads just to
>> get Fedora. They haven't bought in yet. Current community members have.
> I think people can expect a "here's what we're about, let us walk you
> through" to something like Linux. It's not like buying a new handsoap or
Huh? I'm not following at all. I want to try Linux, I don't want to get a
tour of every single desktop environment available.
>> I'm also curious how this design would interact with the big 'download'
>> button on the front page that has been proposed.
> Goes to this page if OS == Linux and where the big download goes for !=
> Linux? If could go to this page no matter what. There are websites that
> have a button on the frontpage that doesn't link straight to a file. I can
> find some if you want, but I've hit them enough that I think you've
> probably seen them too.
The point behind the button is to have one-click download....
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