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[Ambassadors] NA Ambassadors Meeting 2008-08-20 IRC Log



(08:00:04 PM) ke4qqq: ok - it's 9pm EDT/0100 UTC  - so first things
first - is there a volunteer to handle the log and summary?
(08:00:25 PM) ***inode0 raises hand
(08:00:32 PM) ke4qqq: cool - roll call
(08:00:40 PM) lcafiero: Larry Cafiero, presente
(08:00:41 PM) ***iWolf is here
(08:01:04 PM) dramsey: ***dramsey is here
(08:01:10 PM) ***DemonJester is present
(08:01:25 PM) ke4qqq: welcome dramsey - first meeting?
(08:01:32 PM) dramsey: yup.
(08:01:40 PM) herlo: ClintSavage is here!
(08:02:01 PM) ***herlo is only here for 59 minutes :)
(08:02:04 PM) herlo: oh 58
(08:02:07 PM) ke4qqq: alright - others will join as they come in -
first item of business FAMSCO news?? iWolf?
(08:02:30 PM) iWolf: it was another canceled meeting last week, so
nothing to really report.  The list has been relatively quiet as well.
(08:02:45 PM) iWolf: its been hard getting everyone's schedule to
match up these past few weeks.
(08:02:53 PM) herlo: iWolf: summer does that to people
(08:03:23 PM) ke4qqq: ok - moving on - task list
(08:03:29 PM) ke4qqq: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/NA
(08:03:46 PM) ke4qqq: first up contacting local ambassadors -
(08:03:55 PM) ke4qqq: herlo: inode0 and I
(08:03:59 PM) ke4qqq: anyone care to report?
(08:04:19 PM) jtaber: hi from texas
(08:04:34 PM) inode0: 15 contacts attempted, 4 confirmed, 1 bounced, 10 unknown
(08:04:43 PM) ke4qqq: my report is that I have not made any additional
contacts this week - sorry for being a slacker.
(08:04:45 PM) ke4qqq: outstanding
(08:05:13 PM) ***herlo has been on vacation and planning UTOSC, no
contacts made this week
(08:05:54 PM) ke4qqq: alright moving on
(08:06:03 PM) ke4qqq: Ambassadorkit?
(08:06:24 PM) herlo: well, I created a page for it and am making
significant process on pricing out Media
(08:06:39 PM) herlo: CDs specifically for a run of 3k at $.59
(08:06:51 PM) herlo: including fulfillment and printing sleeves
(08:07:24 PM) herlo: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/AmbassadorKit
(08:07:28 PM) ***ke4qqq would really like to get our 'plan' hammered
before next meeting wrt media.
(08:07:32 PM) herlo: if you want to add detail, feel free to do so
(08:07:49 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: that's not likely to happen as I won't be
at the next meeting
(08:07:52 PM) iWolf: sounds like great pricing on media.
(08:08:02 PM) iWolf: really stretches the dollar.
(08:08:03 PM) herlo: although, I don't see a reason you guys couldn't
finish it up
(08:08:06 PM) inode0: do we have budget now for F10 production?
(08:08:10 PM) ke4qqq: well we'll assume that.
(08:08:17 PM) herlo: iWolf: yes, I have a good broker now in that market
(08:08:26 PM) herlo: he's used the guys before and they've given us a
great price
(08:08:31 PM) ke4qqq: we have a budget for something like a month -
which probably means that we'll do livecds in november....
(08:08:40 PM) ke4qqq: and do install media when more money comes in
(08:08:51 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: right, I said we'd place the order in
Late October so that's a go
(08:08:52 PM) ke4qqq: or at least that's my thought - but
realistically we have money for just over 2 runs
(08:09:43 PM) herlo: sounds good to me 6k discs is a good number
(08:09:50 PM) ke4qqq: not including all of the others things that are going on.
(08:10:00 PM) ke4qqq: and cost dramatically rises if we drop below a 3k run.
(08:10:09 PM) herlo: AmbassadorKit should be something we need to
nudge the Art team on
(08:10:12 PM) iWolf: if one of you could write up the deal you are
getting, who the vendor is and any other details or plans you have for
producing media and then email Max and I - we'll make sure it sees the
right people.
(08:10:24 PM) herlo: they've been a bit involved in getting the art
for F10 made up, so maybe after sept 1
(08:10:32 PM) iWolf: i can't imagine people saying no to that media deal though.
(08:10:48 PM) herlo: iWolf: sure, we have to work through my friend,
but the price is still right
(08:11:03 PM) ke4qqq: iwolf - already a task for us!
(08:11:16 PM) iWolf: ke4qqq: :)
(08:11:25 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: iWolf: that isn't a difficult task, I
already have all the information
(08:11:37 PM) ke4qqq: thats why I volunteered to help :)
(08:11:40 PM) ke4qqq: lol
(08:11:47 PM) herlo: lol
(08:11:52 PM) ke4qqq: anything more on ambassador kit and media?
(08:12:07 PM) herlo: I'd like to bring up EventBox for a moment
(08:12:10 PM) inode0: any news on the holders?
(08:12:11 PM) herlo: if that's okay
(08:12:15 PM) ke4qqq: sure
(08:12:25 PM) herlo: inode0: holders, as in the DIY boxes?
(08:12:27 PM) inode0: from the artsy crowd?
(08:12:30 PM) inode0: yes
(08:12:49 PM) herlo: inode0: like I said, they are kind of focused on
F10 artwork, but after that, I expect it to be a breeze
(08:12:52 PM) herlo: looking at mid sept
(08:13:24 PM) herlo: so for the EventBox, I'm going to spend a bit of
hte money I got for UTOSC doing some research and purchasing a good
box to hold the items in an eventbox
(08:13:32 PM) inode0: ok, I'm expecting button art around end of month
(08:13:45 PM) herlo: EMEA has a great box and ours is apparently a bit weak
(08:13:59 PM) ke4qqq: what kind of box???
(08:14:00 PM) rislam: RashadulIslam
(08:14:04 PM) rislam: sorry for being late
(08:14:07 PM) herlo: this is according to my impressions from quaid
(08:14:07 PM) ke4qqq: nw
(08:14:42 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: likely a tough and light shipping box
that can hold a decent set of banners and other gear
(08:14:58 PM) ke4qqq: what dimensions do you need?
(08:15:00 PM) iWolf: herlo: something like the pelican box on the EventBox page?
(08:15:03 PM) herlo: I think this is an appropriate use of the funds,
any suggestions
(08:15:12 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: unknown yet, just wanted to get it out there yet
(08:15:20 PM) herlo: iWolf: yes, something like that...
(08:15:30 PM) ***ke4qqq loves pelican boxes
(08:15:31 PM) herlo: iWolf: but probably not as tall and wider
(08:15:43 PM) herlo: the trick is getting a 6x3 banner into it
(08:16:10 PM) iWolf: You can roll it and as long as you have a
3'diagonal probably be fine.
(08:16:13 PM) herlo: not to detract, just informing that I'll be
performing this research soon...
(08:16:14 PM) ke4qqq: do we need one of those separate containers?
(08:16:17 PM) herlo: iWolf: right on...
(08:16:21 PM) iWolf: will the box have room for future improvements,
such as LCDs?
(08:16:25 PM) iWolf: a shuttle box?
(08:16:27 PM) iWolf: etc.
(08:16:28 PM) herlo: I hope so
(08:16:35 PM) iWolf: great, sounds good.
(08:16:49 PM) iWolf: i think we should use a few NA events to fill this box up.
(08:16:55 PM) ke4qqq: perhaps we need one of those cylindrical cases
that places ship banners in - I might have access to one that was
abandoned by my marketing dept.
(08:17:04 PM) iWolf: so from OLF budget, some of the things we get,
will get used for the show and added to the box.
(08:17:07 PM) herlo: cost of shipping tends to be an issue with lcds
and things, so I'll keep that in mind though
(08:17:07 PM) herlo: I'd like the shipping cost of an eventbox to be
under $50 each time
(08:17:07 PM) herlo: ground
(08:17:15 PM) iWolf: after a few shows we'd have a full box.
(08:17:16 PM) herlo: iWolf: same here
(08:17:29 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: quaid already has one of thoes
(08:17:34 PM) ke4qqq: ahhh ok
(08:17:44 PM) iWolf: herlo: when I priced out the shipping for an 85
pound box it seemed to range from $50 to $85 to ship.
(08:17:45 PM) herlo: but I'm not sure its of the quality you are referring
(08:17:59 PM) herlo: iWolf: across country?  or just a few states?
(08:18:00 PM) ke4qqq: would keeping it separate allow us more flexibility ?
(08:18:04 PM) ***herlo guesses the lower is closer
(08:18:19 PM) ianweller_afk is now known as ianweller
(08:18:21 PM) iWolf: I ran the prices off the UPS web site (though
without discounts).
(08:18:25 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: dunno, this is where the research is
gonna come in, so expect questions over the next month or so...
(08:18:32 PM) iWolf: and I got the weight from the Gnome event box.
(08:18:38 PM) herlo: right
(08:18:39 PM) herlo: ok
(08:18:53 PM) ***herlo feels like this can be discussed more in the
coming month.
(08:18:59 PM) iWolf: herlo: from Ohio to the West coast on the high side.
(08:19:24 PM) ke4qqq: ok - so you are going to start a convo about
that on the m-l?
(08:19:44 PM) herlo: iWolf: right, so my next question is where am I
going to ship the eventbox once I'm done with it?
(08:20:00 PM) herlo: according ot the calendar, there are two events
ahead of OLF, but they aren't more than 150 ppl
(08:20:01 PM) iWolf: herlo: possibly to OLF?  Is there another big
event between yours and it?
(08:20:03 PM) ke4qqq: Nowhere - you ship when the next event needs it
- not when you are done.
(08:20:18 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: right, and that's only a month after mine
(08:20:25 PM) ***ke4qqq misunderstood the question - ignore me
(08:20:29 PM) herlo: which is why I plan to do research first :)
(08:20:46 PM) herlo: but I wanted to put together that shipping policy
about eventbox
(08:22:29 PM) ke4qqq: which is another item - I assume with UTOSC on
your plate it will be a few weeks til we hear further on that?
(08:22:30 PM) herlo: and a minimum conference size might be good
(08:22:54 PM) vwbusguy: here
(08:22:55 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: probably yeah
(08:23:15 PM) ***herlo wants to move onto the next item, this was more
fyi september will be a busy fedora research month :)
(08:23:24 PM) ke4qqq: anything further on AKs, EBs, media, or shipping policy
(08:23:43 PM) ke4qqq: ok - iWolf: FAD?
(08:24:14 PM) iWolf: I have the wiki page up,
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FAD/FADNA2008
(08:24:16 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: wait, can we change the task on media to
read 'move media replication' and be more generic?
(08:24:23 PM) ***herlo signs up to FAD
(08:24:26 PM) iWolf: now I need to publicize.
(08:24:36 PM) ke4qqq: herlo - yes
(08:24:43 PM) iWolf: if the folks here tonight that are planning on
coming could add their names, that would be great.
(08:24:45 PM) ke4qqq: is there anything we can do to help you with that?
(08:24:55 PM) iWolf: i plan to email the ambassador list and a blog
post for publicity.
(08:25:04 PM) ke4qqq: want more people to do blog posts?
(08:25:14 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: tx
(08:25:26 PM) iWolf: yeah, the more the merrier.
(08:25:27 PM) herlo: iWolf: which should we add ours under
(08:25:27 PM) iWolf: helps show others are going.
(08:25:48 PM) iWolf: herlo: responsible would be great.  I am hoping
we sort of do this one as a team.
(08:25:55 PM) iWolf: so I can focus on the booth for OLF.
(08:26:08 PM) iWolf: though I will still help with FAD too.
(08:26:24 PM) ke4qqq: ok - so first thing is we need three people to
step up and do a blog post about FAD this week volunteers?
(08:26:40 PM) ***iWolf volunteers
(08:26:49 PM) herlo: iWolf: added under Possible for now, likely will
become responsible in a few weeks
(08:26:50 PM) ke4qqq: you don't count
(08:26:58 PM) lcafiero: blog where?
(08:26:59 PM) iWolf: herlo: sounds good.
(08:27:01 PM) iWolf: ke4qqq: :)
(08:27:04 PM) herlo: lcafiero: on your blog
(08:27:08 PM) ke4qqq: on your blog
(08:27:15 PM) lcafiero: I can
(08:27:19 PM) herlo: probalby one that syndicates to fedora planet :)
(08:27:20 PM) ke4qqq: hopefully it's aggregated on the planet!
(08:27:26 PM) lcafiero: Um, not yet.
(08:27:27 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: jinx :)
(08:27:38 PM) herlo: lcafiero: if you need help with that, I can help you
(08:27:43 PM) lcafiero: Maybe I can find out after the meeting how to do that?
(08:27:45 PM) ke4qqq: lcafiero: if there is no reason not to can we
get that going first and then post the blog entry.
(08:27:53 PM) ke4qqq: absolutely!
(08:27:58 PM) herlo: yay
(08:27:59 PM) ke4qqq: who else?
(08:27:59 PM) herlo: teamwork
(08:28:08 PM) herlo: I can try, but no promises
(08:28:09 PM) ke4qqq: DemonJester: ?
(08:28:23 PM) DemonJester: I can but I also need to get on the planet
(08:28:35 PM) herlo: jtaber: you could blog your new ambassadorship
and let people know about FAD at OLF :)
(08:28:44 PM) ke4qqq: we can hook you up with that DemonJester
(08:28:53 PM) DemonJester: count me in then
(08:29:17 PM) jtaber: sure
(08:29:26 PM) ke4qqq: jtaber: wanna round out our three?
(08:29:33 PM) rislam: i will try to send the message to all
Ambassadors in Canada
(08:30:05 PM) lcafiero: There are a couple of groups on Facebook
around Fedora -- I can post there, too, if you think it will help
(08:30:11 PM) jtaber: I need to get subscribed to whatever planets
there are here in TX
(08:30:11 PM) ke4qqq: outstanding rislam!
(08:30:15 PM) ke4qqq: absolutely lcafiero
(08:30:25 PM) herlo: rislam: read the email, very nice
(08:30:27 PM) rislam: facebook works well too
(08:30:29 PM) ***ke4qqq adds planet subscription to bottom of agenda.
(08:30:44 PM) ***herlo doesn't like facebook, but sees its value
(08:30:49 PM) ke4qqq: anything else we can do this week to help move
things along iWolf
(08:30:56 PM) rislam: i try to resend the same but different emails as request
(08:31:04 PM) lcafiero: +1 herlo -- was conned onto it and while there
sought to use it.
(08:31:23 PM) iWolf: i think getting the publicity out is the key
thing this week.  then work on forming up the agenda/meeting times we
already touched on a week or so ago.
(08:31:38 PM) ke4qqq: ok - well deal with agenda next week then.
(08:31:44 PM) rislam: i go with iwolfà
(08:31:56 PM) ke4qqq: and we'll get you some press this week.
(08:32:17 PM) ke4qqq: ready for next item?
(08:32:20 PM) herlo: yep
(08:32:23 PM) iWolf: yep
(08:32:24 PM) inode0: will the OLF agenda be out then? sort of
planning on trying to get to some of that too
(08:32:37 PM) iWolf: inode0: not sure, they announced the keynote speakers.
(08:32:54 PM) inode0: waiting to hear what LOPSA is doing mostly
(08:33:12 PM) iWolf: the talk deadline ended yesterday, so probably a
little bit before they decide who is accepted.
(08:33:17 PM) ke4qqq: alright next is a short sound bite - please
review https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/NorthAmerica/Expectations
 - eidt it comment about it, flame me for writing it. but thus far
herlo has two edits and the rest are mine.
(08:33:18 PM) zodbot: <http://tinyurl.com/6f6hth> (at fedoraproject.org)
(08:34:11 PM) ke4qqq: next item isn't due yet so onto the next agenda item.
(08:34:20 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: I thought we were gonna talk about
must/shoulds/coulds
(08:34:30 PM) ke4qqq: ahhh cool - lets talk then
(08:34:32 PM) herlo: oh, that is
(08:34:37 PM) herlo: nm
(08:34:43 PM) ke4qqq: no please discussion is good
(08:34:50 PM) inode0: line between coulds and shoulds seems pretty
arbitrary to me
(08:34:51 PM) ke4qqq:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/NorthAmerica/Expectations
(08:34:51 PM) zodbot: <http://tinyurl.com/6f6hth> (at fedoraproject.org)
(08:35:16 PM) ke4qqq: it is - one person wrote it and made the line
where he saw fit - but it's a wiki and can be moved.... :)
(08:35:29 PM) inode0: would like to consider have more abstract
statements of expectations with examples maybe of what might fall into
them
(08:35:32 PM) lcafiero: It looks good at first glance.
(08:35:49 PM) ***herlo had something to add, now forgets
(08:35:55 PM) inode0: what is there being such examples
(08:36:03 PM) ***ke4qqq patches welcome :)
(08:36:14 PM) rislam: please make sure there somewhere written that
everybody should also part of their region and
(08:36:34 PM) herlo: should - add themselves to the Regions page
(08:36:39 PM) herlo: rislam: is this what you mean?
(08:36:40 PM) rislam: yes
(08:36:41 PM) ke4qqq: adds task for rislam :)
(08:36:58 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: lol, that's just one edit...
(08:37:00 PM) rislam: i already send an email about this
(08:37:10 PM) herlo: rislam: can you edit the wiki?
(08:37:15 PM) herlo: you should be able to
(08:37:16 PM) rislam: yes i can
(08:37:22 PM) ke4qqq: really- this isn't my document - please
participate in it - everyone here (to my knowledge) has edit rights -
.....
(08:37:32 PM) lcafiero: Could we add something under "could" about
activity in LUGs?
(08:37:35 PM) herlo: its a good thing to learn, and a perfect place to
contribute
(08:37:41 PM) herlo: lcafiero: add it :)
(08:37:43 PM) ke4qqq: lcafiero: you can add whatever you want  :)
(08:37:51 PM) ***herlo loves the suggestions
(08:37:56 PM) ke4qqq: me too -
(08:37:58 PM) rislam: but where will be the perfect place
(08:38:12 PM) ***ke4qqq appreciates herlo bringing the subject back
for discussion rather than dismissing it.
(08:38:14 PM) herlo: rislam: what do you mean?  Expectations page is
the great spot
(08:38:32 PM) rislam: i mean in should or could
(08:38:39 PM) herlo: rislam: ahh
(08:38:53 PM) ***inode0 votes should for that
(08:39:02 PM) rislam: +1
(08:39:04 PM) herlo: rislam: I read 'should' when you just typed it
(08:39:21 PM) inode0: or even must if we have thoughts of using it for
anything administrative
(08:39:22 PM) rislam: inode call for vote already herlo
(08:39:23 PM) ***herlo thinks that's correct
(08:39:29 PM) lcafiero: Added
(08:39:30 PM) herlo: rislam: lol, k
(08:39:36 PM) jtaber: could - add picture to wiki page
(08:39:45 PM) herlo: jtaber: nice
(08:39:52 PM) inode0: main thing is get it on there, it can be
shuffled around later
(08:39:52 PM) ***herlo waits for jtaber to add that :)
(08:40:35 PM) jtaber: actually will talk at utos - wanted to know
where to upload png
(08:40:36 PM) rislam: do I edit it to the should
(08:40:39 PM) ***ke4qqq adds that task for jtaber to add.
(08:40:48 PM) ***ianweller commences lurking
(08:40:51 PM) lcafiero: Are we voting on something?
(08:40:52 PM) inode0: that is fine rislam
(08:41:06 PM) ke4qqq: lcafiero: no - idiomatic expression
(08:41:31 PM) herlo: did we lose rislam?
(08:41:59 PM) ke4qqq: what else should we discuss?
(08:42:01 PM) rislam: sry i was dc
(08:42:03 PM) ke4qqq: about this page?
(08:42:03 PM) herlo: jtaber: add it to the wiki is easy, I can created
it for you now
(08:42:12 PM) inode0: we can each pick a number between 1 and 50 for
each category (must, should, could) for where it should go :)
(08:42:18 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: I think we should revisit it again next few weeks
(08:42:34 PM) lcafiero: In the meantime, if we have ideas, we can post them.
(08:42:38 PM) ***inode0 apologizes for that
(08:42:39 PM) herlo: inode0: I think many of them are well defined,
but you are right about some
(08:42:43 PM) ke4qqq: yes - post them on the wiki
(08:43:05 PM) rislam: i edit already
(08:43:15 PM) herlo: inode0: in fact, most things that are ambiguous
should be put in the 'coulds' section because others might consider a
should or must too restrictive
(08:43:19 PM) herlo: we can alwasy move things up
(08:43:22 PM) ke4qqq: and we'll discuss changes - that's a task for
everyone - review the page and at least comment- I know that no one
likes it 100%
(08:43:26 PM) rislam: if everybody say yes than I press save
(08:43:40 PM) herlo: rislam: press save
(08:43:43 PM) ke4qqq: press save!
(08:44:07 PM) lcafiero: Yeah, you can't please everyone, but ke4qqq,
it's a pretty solid document
(08:44:10 PM) inode0: herlo: my problem is mostly around not feeling
blogging should be elevated above other forms of communicating with
others about Fedora
(08:44:10 PM) herlo: jtaber: nice
(08:44:42 PM) ke4qqq: inode0: great! - what other forms should be
there?? or where should blogging move to?
(08:44:46 PM) herlo: inode0: I agree with you, we should put
importance on all forms of communication, but this can be hammered out
over time.  i'm not sure if its a could, or a should
(08:44:54 PM) rislam: done
(08:44:56 PM) inode0: thinks "communicate with others about Fedora"
might be a should. examples would be blogging, attending LUGs, etc.
(08:44:59 PM) herlo: yay
(08:45:09 PM) ke4qqq: outstanding
(08:45:19 PM) iWolf: sounds great!
(08:45:21 PM) ***ke4qqq expects to see some of these changes in the
not too distant future.
(08:45:21 PM) DemonJester: inode0: dont forget IRC ;-)
(08:45:38 PM) rislam: one more thing I have found that
(08:45:41 PM) ke4qqq: yeah - hanging out in #fedora has to rate pretty
high , esp over the past few days.
(08:45:43 PM) lcafiero: Is mainstream media handled elsewhere?
(08:45:57 PM) lcafiero: [Shamed to say I work for the mainstream media]
(08:46:00 PM) inode0: I won't, and the list is longer still ... just
thinking about more abstract categories
(08:46:03 PM) ke4qqq: lcafiero: by mainstream do you mean Linuxworld
or do you mean CBS
(08:46:20 PM) herlo: DemonJester: the problem with irc is it is
regularly *not* logged.
(08:46:44 PM) DemonJester: herlo: true and that is probably a good
thing at times!
(08:47:11 PM) herlo: DemonJester: right, but its not a viable messaging platform
(08:47:19 PM) herlo: that's all I was arguing
(08:47:27 PM) DemonJester: herlo: agrees
(08:47:29 PM) ***kanarip bets that IRC is logged a multitude compared
to whatever else could be logged
(08:47:45 PM) ke4qqq: so one of the things that I have been impressed
with on IRC is ability to take the user to contributor - ianweller for
instance brought a new contributor from #fedora to docs project a few
weeks ago
(08:47:55 PM) inode0: it is am important communication channel,
actually talking about Fedora in #rhel sends people to other Fedora
venues
(08:48:20 PM) ke4qqq: so yeah it may not be directly recordable that
you spent 80 hours on IRC - but recording the results can be.
(08:48:28 PM) ***herlo agrees on these points
(08:48:57 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: right, but where do you record the
results, in IRC? or on a blog/mail
(08:49:19 PM) inode0: did we just move into tracking?
(08:49:25 PM) ke4qqq: herlo: I don't know the answer right now -
perhaps in a blog- perhaps in some spreadysheed
(08:49:29 PM) ke4qqq: wow
(08:49:32 PM) ke4qqq: spreadsheet
(08:49:39 PM) herlo: perfect segue
(08:49:53 PM) ***ke4qqq planned that :)
(08:50:04 PM) herlo: lol
(08:50:07 PM) herlo: +1`
(08:50:21 PM) herlo: that's a ' above a 1
(08:50:41 PM) ke4qqq: so - everyone I expect that page to be the
heaviest edited page this week on the wiki
(08:50:49 PM) ke4qqq: now lets talk about tracking - how do we do that
(08:50:50 PM) lcafiero: heh
(08:51:18 PM) rislam: i have to leave now
(08:51:28 PM) ke4qqq: thanks for coming rislam
(08:51:29 PM) ke4qqq: !
(08:51:29 PM) herlo: well, I think that's the challenge.  NA Regional
ambassadors take the challenge to record data
(08:51:31 PM) rislam: i will send the email to everyone by tomorrow
(08:51:37 PM) herlo: and put it somewhere
(08:51:41 PM) ke4qqq: great!
(08:51:45 PM) herlo: rislam: keep this last bit in mind :)
(08:51:52 PM) herlo: rislam: have a good one man
(08:51:56 PM) ke4qqq: but what do we record - and second how do we get
that which we record
(08:52:07 PM) rislam: thank u herlo
(08:52:11 PM) herlo: the what: blogs, mailings, etc
(08:52:26 PM) herlo: anything that will put the fedoraproject out in
front of the public
(08:52:43 PM) ke4qqq:  or is a plus for fedora - like a new contributor
(08:52:55 PM) ke4qqq: the results of being out in front of the public
(08:53:03 PM) jtaber: if ambassadors blog about activities and are
subscribed to Fedora Planet then easier for regional guys to keep
track of
(08:53:08 PM) herlo: the how: regional ambassadors (and any others who
wish to contribute for us) will keep a wiki page of links to these
details
(08:53:16 PM) herlo: most of the details can be linked
(08:53:39 PM) herlo: jtaber: true, but not everyone who is an
ambassador cares to blog about it
(08:53:45 PM) herlo: or send email for that matter
(08:53:52 PM) ke4qqq: jtaber: it would - but somedays - the planet
cycles pretty fast and then it's gone
(08:54:15 PM) herlo: some do what they do because they can and don't
care to share with the world, even though that's important to us
(08:54:26 PM) herlo: quantifying it is another issue altogether
(08:54:42 PM) ***herlo needs to go in 2 minutes
(08:54:55 PM) ke4qqq: so what metrics?? gregdek mentioned that local
media coverage was big time important....
(08:55:36 PM) ke4qqq: in my mind new contributors are important....
(08:55:48 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: how about we start tracking dates and
where the item was found
(08:56:12 PM) ke4qqq: ok - that's not a bad start......even if it's
anecdotal at first -
(08:56:14 PM) herlo: if you see an article, blog post, email, etc, we
should put it on a page in some sort of simple fashion
(08:56:27 PM) herlo: I'm thinking columns like so
(08:56:44 PM) ***ke4qqq imagines herlo using his hands to describe
columns over irc
(08:56:52 PM) herlo: | Title / Information | Extra Detail | Date |
Link | Comments |
(08:57:05 PM) herlo: ke4qqq: does that work better than hands? :-P
(08:57:10 PM) ***herlo now has to go...
(08:57:18 PM) ke4qqq: yes!
(08:57:24 PM) ke4qqq: have a good evening
(08:57:35 PM) ke4qqq: alright what's left on the agenda
(08:57:39 PM) iWolf: later herlo
(08:57:44 PM) ke4qqq: or do we wish to discuss this more?
(08:57:52 PM) inode0: open floor? tonight's mail from themayor?
(08:58:06 PM) lcafiero: Interesting.
(08:58:07 PM) jtaber: okay if blogs not the best, then ambassadors
should be asked to post to mail list - if they don't want to then they
simply go unreported - that way regional guys get it in their mailbox,
can cut and paste, etc
(08:59:00 PM) ke4qqq: jtaber: yeah - the part is getting compliance -
and we can't force the issue - so it has to be gentle prodding I
suppose
(08:59:17 PM) inode0: jtaber: I think the regional guys are willing to
touch base directly with ambassadors periodically and filter reports
from there too
(08:59:33 PM) ke4qqq: +1
(08:59:42 PM) lcafiero: Agreed
(08:59:44 PM) ke4qqq: the problem is who do we touch base with - we
are trying to work that out
(09:00:00 PM) ke4qqq: but there are almost 600 ambassadors
(09:00:03 PM) inode0: yeah, eventually the people on the map :)
(09:00:18 PM) inode0: not in NA
(09:00:19 PM) ke4qqq: yes
(09:00:25 PM) ke4qqq: btw if you aren't on the map.....
(09:00:49 PM) ***ke4qqq searches for link to map
(09:01:44 PM) ***ke4qqq can't find it
(09:01:53 PM) jds2001: gack
(09:01:57 PM) ke4qqq: I'll email the list and ask you to put yourself
on it if you aren't already
(09:02:04 PM) lcafiero: rislam I think sent an e-mail about it today
(09:02:06 PM) ***jds2001 missed it, right?
(09:02:08 PM) lcafiero: Let me see if I can find it.
(09:02:13 PM) ke4qqq: no still going on jds2001
(09:02:40 PM) LinuxKnight: fp.org/wiki/Ambassadors/NA/Regions
(09:02:42 PM) LinuxKnight: ?
(09:02:43 PM) lcafiero: Is this it?
(09:02:44 PM) inode0: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/NA/Active
(09:02:48 PM) lcafiero: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/NA/Regions
(09:03:11 PM) ke4qqq: yeah both are it
(09:03:28 PM) inode0: should use Regions though
(09:03:43 PM) ke4qqq: yeah prolly should - that other word is verboten
(09:03:58 PM) ***ke4qqq makes note to delete that page
(09:03:59 PM) ***DemonJester adding himself right after meeting
(09:04:16 PM) ke4qqq: so if nothing further lets talk about jaa's
message to the list.
(09:04:59 PM) ke4qqq: inode0: want to start with your thoughts while I
find a link to the message?
(09:05:27 PM) ke4qqq:
https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-ambassadors-list/2008-August/msg00254.html
(09:05:28 PM) zodbot: <http://tinyurl.com/5lcjsy> (at www.redhat.com)
(09:05:49 PM) inode0: to be fair any thoughts now are initial
reactions since there hasn't really been time for that much thought
(09:06:37 PM) dramsey: Do we know what happened and/or why this
message was sent?
(09:06:45 PM) inode0: and my initial reaction to it was that it sounds
more like a Red Hat project than it does a Fedora project currently
(09:06:49 PM) ke4qqq: yes - perhaps I should tell that -
(09:07:32 PM) iWolf: inode0: those were my exact thoughts as well -
again, initial reaction.
(09:08:14 PM) ke4qqq: ummm Jack sent a message a few months back
saying he was going to start a campus rep program that was separate.
He promised a wiki page RSN. a few weeks back he attended a meeting
and there was some disconnect - we had real problems communicating
(technical ones), and then a blog post which we assumed involved the
campus rep program (because it didn't say otherwise)
(09:08:16 PM) jds2001: i filter ambassadors mail and barely have time
to read it.
(09:08:30 PM) jds2001: a brief read of that, though - leaves me with
the same feeling
(09:08:57 PM) dramsey: ke4qqq understood.  :)
(09:09:00 PM) ke4qqq: so anyway I fired off an email expressing my concern
(09:09:29 PM) ke4qqq: and he talked with inode0, quaid and I in irc
and promised to send a mail. He also said he was going to be around
for the meeting, but had a family emergency in LA and is in the air
even as we type
(09:10:31 PM) inode0: this sounds like it will be quite some time
before Fedora would be involved so I think I'm interested in pursuing
our own initiatives now
(09:10:49 PM) lcafiero: This is the first I've heard of most of this,
but then I'm new, however I did get to talk to Jack about this at
LinuxWorld.
(09:10:50 PM) dramsey: ke4qqq thank you.  :)
(09:10:53 PM) inode0: it also sounds like it doesn't really overlap
much with things I have in mind
(09:11:05 PM) lcafiero: The e-mail seems to focus on what's NOT going
to happen, as opposed to what IS going to happen
(09:11:27 PM) inode0: That was largely a reaction to our earlier
conversation I'm afraid.
(09:11:35 PM) lcafiero: Ah.
(09:12:01 PM) ke4qqq: so the concerns (from my perspective) are really
- this isn't an open process - ie it's being kept quiet (until
recently) and is likely to stay quiet.
(09:12:36 PM) iWolf: ke4qqq: that is my major concern as well.
(09:12:36 PM) lcafiero: agreed
(09:12:40 PM) inode0: I'm in favor of proposing what we'd like to do,
if he thinks any of it would interfere he can let us know
(09:12:56 PM) lcafiero: inode +1
(09:13:04 PM) lcafiero: inode0 (sorry)
(09:13:36 PM) ke4qqq: so read the mail - resesarch on the marketing
list the earlier posts - talk with jack - he says he will be here next
week.
(09:13:50 PM) ke4qqq: I personally want to avoid the 'eat your brane' problem
(09:13:58 PM) dramsey: Me, too.
(09:14:06 PM) lcafiero: Agendize this for next week?
(09:14:11 PM) inode0: I can propose several fairly concrete things
(09:14:21 PM) ke4qqq: http://lwn.net/Articles/83360/
(09:15:01 PM) jtaber: I was a bit puzzled as to some comments - here
are some of my thoughts: 1) curriculum implemtation is hard - must go
thru faculty committees, etc.  But having one I guess makes it easier
for any that want to implement it  2) I think the student club idea is
good - we could sponsor student fedora club leaders with t-shirts
(they like that)  3) students don't present a face to faculty - and
faculty is used to corporate sponsorship in
(09:16:29 PM) inode0: (1) is definitely hard and it makes perfect
sense to work with one or two schools to get a model implemented
(09:16:49 PM) ke4qqq: yes - but it should be an open process IMO -
seneca has certailny opened up with them
(09:16:59 PM) inode0: that is probably the only point I strongly agree with
(09:17:58 PM) dramsey: Good point.
(09:17:59 PM) inode0: I don't think RHH should be a program with elite
schools - actually hearing that was discouraging but again maybe it
sounded different than it was meant
(09:18:01 PM) ke4qqq: anyone else want to comment.
(09:18:26 PM) inode0: and RHH is not a Fedora project, it is a Red Hat project
(09:18:54 PM) lcafiero: reading e-mail more in depth -- wondering how
RH/Fedora project mesh, if at all.
(09:19:14 PM) ***DemonJester wondering the same thing..
(09:19:16 PM) LinuxKnight: +1..., sounded more like a RH thing, with
maybe some ambassadors helping on the side...
(09:19:21 PM) iWolf: the lack of openness is a big issue with me, as
others have said - this looks more like a RH project than a Fedora
project.
(09:19:41 PM) inode0: there is overlap, the new Fedora scholarships
being an example, but again a Red Hat driven program so far as I can
tell
(09:19:50 PM) iWolf: I also think the ambassadors fits into the campus
reps thing quite well, why reinvent the wheel here.
(09:19:58 PM) lcafiero: Agreed. Openness is a strike issue with me.
(09:20:11 PM) ke4qqq: which is GREAT - if it involves RH - but if it
is Fedora - then it needs to be open and allow for involvement, IMO -
initial reaction
(09:20:19 PM) iWolf: ke4qqq: agreed.
(09:20:50 PM) dramsey: Must go, thank you folks, til next week.  :)
(09:20:59 PM) ke4qqq: thanks dramsey
(09:21:12 PM) inode0: so let's move forward with our agenda - when
they think we can help we can revisit it
(09:21:21 PM) lcafiero: I talked with Jack at LinuxWorld (we were in
the booth together) and we talked briefly about how 1. might work with
my own group on campus
(09:21:47 PM) lcafiero: But let's move on.
(09:22:32 PM) inode0: lcafiero: I wasn't trying to stop this
conversation - just suggesting we propose what we'd like to do and
proceed
(09:22:41 PM) jtaber: I see students working more with Fedora on their
own machines to get latest and greatest as opposed to RHEL on school
machines so still think Fedora plays part in student user groups
(09:23:14 PM) inode0: true although those tracking this see a fairly
steep decline over recent years
(09:23:41 PM) ke4qqq: inode0: I don't know that we are in a position
to propose anything yet - other than openness perhaps.
(09:23:51 PM) inode0: I am :)
(09:24:20 PM) lcafiero: Should we all answer Jack's e-mail with our
concernes on list to see if there can be some sort of discussion?
(09:24:20 PM) inode0: I'll write up some thoughts for us to chew on
(09:24:26 PM) ke4qqq: YES!!! +1 lcafiero
(09:24:32 PM) iWolf: lcafiero: +1
(09:24:43 PM) jtaber: +1
(09:25:08 PM) iWolf: inode0: i would be interested in seeing your
thoughts.  i hate to see the ambassadors stall out over what seems to
be a RH initiative.
(09:25:14 PM) ke4qqq: ok - so the people who spoke up here - dramsey,
jtaber iWolf LinuxKnight lcafiero inode0 and I are all responsible for
a post to the list.
(09:25:29 PM) inode0: I talked with gregdek about this a long time ago
and asked what was the #1 thing Red Hat would like from universities
(09:25:58 PM) inode0: His answer was a decisive one: an open source
curriculum where students learned real open source development skills
(09:26:01 PM) lcafiero: I'm on it.
(09:26:31 PM) inode0: That made perfect sense to me coming from Red Hat
(09:27:03 PM) DemonJester: future talent pool...
(09:27:08 PM) ke4qqq: seneca has that - but honestly aside from
faculty who are ambassadors I don't think we are in a place to make
that call
(09:27:39 PM) lcafiero: Our G/LUG has some pull at our college --
faculty is very sympathetic
(09:28:15 PM) inode0: and I'm not sure that is such a high priority
with what Fedora might want most either, although no one would object
to that
(09:29:13 PM) ke4qqq: alright - well anything else we can discuss tonight?
(09:29:29 PM) inode0: there is a huge pool of potential contributors
to all parts of the Fedora project at universities just waiting to be
engaged
(09:29:46 PM) inode0: engaging more of them is a higher priority right now to me
(09:29:59 PM) lcafiero: Plus, we are working in california to network
all the state university/UC campus LUGs
(09:30:05 PM) ke4qqq: inode0: +1
(09:30:10 PM) iWolf: inode0: +1
(09:30:47 PM) ke4qqq: probably students who don't know they are even
eligible to get involved.
(09:31:39 PM) jtaber: at our events, we can make extra effort to speak
with interested students
(09:32:05 PM) ke4qqq: and work to get in front of groups of students -
esp those who aren't CS students - like marketing or art students
(09:32:20 PM) ke4qqq: who can get real experience in a product that
actually ships....
(09:32:57 PM) jtaber: we're holding UTOS at a college - will make some
efforts to talk with students
(09:34:02 PM) ke4qqq: cool - and follow up with those that express interest....
(09:34:11 PM) lcafiero: +1
(09:34:39 PM) ke4qqq: alright we are 34 minutes past our schedule -
anything else that needs to come up?
(09:34:48 PM) jtaber: ke4qqq: that's why I thnk student groups are so
valuable - their friends are in those other depts
(09:34:57 PM) ke4qqq: jtaber: yep
(09:35:01 PM) lcafiero: Agreed. I see that first hand.
(09:35:48 PM) lcafiero: Nothing else I can see.
(09:35:58 PM) lcafiero: needing to come up, that is
(09:36:09 PM) ke4qqq: alright we'll close in 5
(09:36:18 PM) ke4qqq: remember blog posts jtaber DemonJester and lcafiero
(09:36:18 PM) ke4qqq: 4
(09:36:45 PM) DemonJester: sending planet request as soon as this ends
(09:36:49 PM) ke4qqq: remember to post back to the mailing list
dramsey, jtaber iWolf LinuxKnight lcafiero inode0 and I
(09:36:51 PM) ke4qqq: 3
(09:36:55 PM) ke4qqq: 2
(09:36:57 PM) ke4qqq: 1
(09:36:59 PM) ke4qqq: closed
(09:37:08 PM) inode0: I see areas like the art team and the marketing
team where students have no idea they can help
(09:37:10 PM) iWolf: ke4qqq: thanks for leading the meeting
(09:37:11 PM) ke4qqq: alright - if you need/want help with getting
your blog on the planet.
(09:37:21 PM) ***iWolf heads off
(09:37:23 PM) lcafiero: (raising hand)
(09:37:23 PM) ke4qqq: iWolf: np -thanks for coming!
(09:37:26 PM) vwbusguy: yay, goodnight
(09:37:35 PM) DemonJester: ke4qqq: sure
(09:37:36 PM) ***LinuxKnight help with planet
(09:37:37 PM) jtaber: keqqq - aren't we waiting for inode to post first ?
(09:37:56 PM) inode0: post what first?
(09:38:00 PM) ke4qqq: not necessarily - you are free to post your views.
(09:38:07 PM) ke4qqq: no need to wait on him
(09:38:18 PM) jtaber: sorry, misunderstood
(09:38:47 PM) inode0: I'll open a new dialog about education as I see
it in the context of Fedora
(09:39:17 PM) inode0: well, in the context of the ambassador program
(09:39:18 PM) jtaber: sounds good.  bye
(09:39:53 PM) ke4qqq: alright - now to get aggregated on the planet
(09:40:07 PM) ke4qqq: actually - lets move this to #fedora-mktg
everyone ok with that?
(09:40:13 PM) lcafiero: Sure.
(09:40:15 PM) LinuxKnight: ok
(09:40:20 PM) inode0: EOF


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