on Hristo Petkov proposal
onkar mirajkar
odmirajkar at gmail.com
Wed Nov 11 11:36:03 UTC 2009
Hi,
I went to one step ahead.
I have a usb modem which i can carry to anywhere. It has memory slot (micro
SD)in it.
I made it as live USB from USB creator.
But unfortunately i am not able to boot.
My plan was make it as live usb and then connect to data center by creating
VPN.So that i can store my data permanently, Also make usb of cloud
computing to give various software as service(SaaS).
Thanks,
Onkar
2009/11/7 Hristo Petkov <vaeood at yahoo.com>
> Hi Guys,
> I have a proposal. In my view this DVD is too complex to be made universal
> for various types of machines. Suppose the good old Live CD is furnished
> with a reference to the Fedora Project website and there to be installed an
> expert system advising the users depending on their machine, their periphery
> and their application goals what to install what is better to install
> instead of what and what is not entirely advisable to be installed. How to
> make a full-featured high-speed desktop from ground zero (from the live CD
> on formatted HD) in a couple of hours, etc.
> Things like that.
> Just a proposal.
> Best regards
> Christo Petkov
>
>
> --- On *Fri, 11/6/09, fedora-desktop-list-request at redhat.com <
> fedora-desktop-list-request at redhat.com>* wrote:
>
>
> From: fedora-desktop-list-request at redhat.com <
> fedora-desktop-list-request at redhat.com>
> Subject: Fedora-desktop-list Digest, Vol 69, Issue 5
> To: fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com
> Date: Friday, November 6, 2009, 12:40 PM
>
> Send Fedora-desktop-list mailing list submissions to
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>
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>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (David Zeuthen)
> 2. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Bill Nottingham)
> 3. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (David Zeuthen)
> 4. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Adam Williamson)
> 5. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Matthias Clasen)
> 6. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (drago01)
> 7. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (David Zeuthen)
> 8. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Seth Vidal)
> 9. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Lars Herrmann)
> 10. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Bill Nottingham)
> 11. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (drago01)
> 12. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (David Zeuthen)
> 13. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Seth Vidal)
> 14. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Lars Herrmann)
> 15. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Matthias Clasen)
> 16. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Paul W. Frields)
> 17. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (Nicu Buculei)
> 18. Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff (onkar mirajkar)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 13:20:13 -0500
> From: David Zeuthen <davidz at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=davidz@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: sundaram at fedoraproject.org<http://mc/compose?to=sundaram@fedoraproject.org>,
> Discussions about development for the
> Fedora desktop <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257445213.15710.18.camel at localhost.localdomain<http://mc/compose?to=1257445213.15710.18.camel@localhost.localdomain>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 14:33 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> > The image size is 1022 M.
>
> This is likely too big, remember drive manufacturers don't really use
> units like KiB MiB or GiB - they use 1K = 1000, 1M = 1,000,000 and 1G =
> 1,000,000,000 - e.g.. the SI units.
>
> It seems to me that most 1GB USB keys have a size of 1GB = 1,000M =
> 1,000,000,000 bytes. Some are 1024MB (1024,000,000,000 bytes), some may
> be a bit smaller (e.g. "value-adds" like the Sandisk U3 "CD-ROM") while
> some may actually be 1024 MiB (1,099,511,627,776 bytes). It varies.
>
> It would probably be helpful to do a quick study of actual sizes of 1GB
> USB sticks - we may end up wanting to do a 990 MB (990,000,000,000
> bytes) image or something so the image works on as many USB sticks as
> possible.
>
> David
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 13:24:54 -0500
> From: Bill Nottingham <notting at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=notting@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <20091105182453.GA16392 at nostromo.devel.redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=20091105182453.GA16392@nostromo.devel.redhat.com>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> David Zeuthen (davidz at redhat.com <http://mc/compose?to=davidz@redhat.com>)
> said:
> > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 14:33 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> > > The image size is 1022 M.
> >
> > This is likely too big, remember drive manufacturers don't really use
> > units like KiB MiB or GiB - they use 1K = 1000, 1M = 1,000,000 and 1G =
> > 1,000,000,000 - e.g. the SI units.
> >
> > It seems to me that most 1GB USB keys have a size of 1GB = 1,000M =
> > 1,000,000,000 bytes. Some are 1024MB (1024,000,000,000 bytes), some may
> > be a bit smaller (e.g. "value-adds" like the Sandisk U3 "CD-ROM") while
> > some may actually be 1024 MiB (1,099,511,627,776 bytes). It varies.
>
> Moreover, the closer you get to the full size, the less space you'll
> have for any overlay.
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 13:35:26 -0500
> From: David Zeuthen <davidz at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=davidz@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257446126.15710.30.camel at localhost.localdomain<http://mc/compose?to=1257446126.15710.30.camel@localhost.localdomain>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 13:24 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote:
> > David Zeuthen (davidz at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=davidz@redhat.com>)
> said:
> > > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 14:33 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> > > > The image size is 1022 M.
> > >
> > > This is likely too big, remember drive manufacturers don't really use
> > > units like KiB MiB or GiB - they use 1K = 1000, 1M = 1,000,000 and 1G =
> > > 1,000,000,000 - e.g. the SI units.
> > >
> > > It seems to me that most 1GB USB keys have a size of 1GB = 1,000M =
> > > 1,000,000,000 bytes. Some are 1024MB (1024,000,000,000 bytes), some may
> > > be a bit smaller (e.g. "value-adds" like the Sandisk U3 "CD-ROM") while
> > > some may actually be 1024 MiB (1,099,511,627,776 bytes). It varies.
> >
> > Moreover, the closer you get to the full size, the less space you'll
> > have for any overlay.
>
> Good point. A quick search on the Internet suggests that 2GB sticks can
> be had for < $10. So maybe we should just bite the bullet and target 2GB
> keys and do a 1.7GB (1,700,000,000 bytes) image leaving ~300MB free for
> the overlay.
>
> Then leaves both wiggle-room and also enables us to include *compelling*
> stuff like Ogg Theora videos featuring Shadowman etc etc.
>
> David
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 11:55:01 -0800
> From: Adam Williamson <awilliam at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=awilliam@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat..com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257450902.2316.11.camel at adam.local.net<http://mc/compose?to=1257450902.2316.11.camel@adam.local.net>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 13:35 -0500, David Zeuthen wrote:
> > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 13:24 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote:
> > > David Zeuthen (davidz at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=davidz@redhat.com>)
> said:
> > > > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 14:33 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> > > > > The image size is 1022 M.
> > > >
> > > > This is likely too big, remember drive manufacturers don't really use
> > > > units like KiB MiB or GiB - they use 1K = 1000, 1M = 1,000,000 and 1G
> =
> > > > 1,000,000,000 - e.g. the SI units.
> > > >
> > > > It seems to me that most 1GB USB keys have a size of 1GB = 1,000M =
> > > > 1,000,000,000 bytes. Some are 1024MB (1024,000,000,000 bytes), some
> may
> > > > be a bit smaller (e.g. "value-adds" like the Sandisk U3 "CD-ROM")
> while
> > > > some may actually be 1024 MiB (1,099,511,627,776 bytes). It varies.
> > >
> > > Moreover, the closer you get to the full size, the less space you'll
> > > have for any overlay.
> >
> > Good point. A quick search on the Internet suggests that 2GB sticks can
> > be had for < $10. So maybe we should just bite the bullet and target 2GB
> > keys and do a 1.7GB (1,700,000,000 bytes) image leaving ~300MB free for
> > the overlay.
> >
> > Then leaves both wiggle-room and also enables us to include *compelling*
> > stuff like Ogg Theora videos featuring Shadowman etc etc.
>
> Personally I think one of the nice things about a live CD image is it
> creates a good restriction for building a nice focused working system in
> a reasonable amount of space. 1GB would more or less keep that; 2GB is
> starting to introduce an awful lot of wiggle room for not caring about
> including useless crap.
>
> And remember, large USB keys may be cheap as chips nowadays but
> bandwidth ain't, always. Aren't there still people in Australia with
> absurd caps like 10GB/month?
>
> I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> image 2GB big'.
>
> --
> Adam Williamson
> Fedora QA Community Monkey
> IRC: adamw | Fedora Talk: adamwill AT fedoraproject DOT org
> http://www.happyassassin.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 14:56:42 -0500
> From: Matthias Clasen <mclasen at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=mclasen@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257451002.1875.2.camel at planemask>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 11:55 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
>
> > I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> > functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> > image 2GB big'.
> >
>
> The biggest gap in terms of 'complete-out-of-the-box' is OpenOffice.
> Including that brings us up to around 850M or so.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 21:05:30 +0100
> From: drago01 <drago01 at gmail.com <http://mc/compose?to=drago01@gmail.com>>
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID:
> <f6ca9fed0911051205i453be449jeb0ec9090c756505 at mail.gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=f6ca9fed0911051205i453be449jeb0ec9090c756505@mail.gmail.com>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 8:56 PM, Matthias Clasen <mclasen at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=mclasen@redhat.com>>
> wrote:
> > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 11:55 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
> >
> >> I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> >> functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> >> image 2GB big'.
> >>
> >
> > The biggest gap in terms of 'complete-out-of-the-box' is OpenOffice.
> > Including that brings us up to around 850M or so.
>
> Finally we can move away from the 1990s (CDs), but yeah I agree
> besides OO.org I can't think of an app that I really miss on the live
> media.
>
> Just because we do have more space available does not mean that we
> have to fill it with random crap.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 15:34:51 -0500
> From: David Zeuthen <davidz at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=davidz@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat..com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257453291.17978.12.camel at localhost.localdomain<http://mc/compose?to=1257453291.17978.12.camel@localhost.localdomain>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 11:55 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
> > Personally I think one of the nice things about a live CD image is it
> > creates a good restriction for building a nice focused working system in
> > a reasonable amount of space. 1GB would more or less keep that; 2GB is
> > starting to introduce an awful lot of wiggle room for not caring about
> > including useless crap.
>
> Nah, this is a bad reason - and if it's the case we're already doomed.
>
> (FWIW, I don't think it's the case - I trust Matthias and other Live CD
> desktop maintainers to put only sensible stuff on our images.)
>
> Also, no-one says we _must_ include useless crap or even use all of the
> space. And no-one says the space we're going to use is to be used for
> software. I've advocated earlier that we should try and promote things
> like Ogg Theora. For example, we could include
>
> http://www.bigbuckbunny.org/
>
> on the media. In my view, that would make Fedora a lot more appealing.
>
> > And remember, large USB keys may be cheap as chips nowadays but
> > bandwidth ain't, always. Aren't there still people in Australia with
> > absurd caps like 10GB/month?
>
> They do have mirrors in Australia.
>
> > I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> > functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> > image 2GB big'.
>
> No one says the desktop image should be "our smallest
> 'complete-out-of-the-box' image". In fact, I think it would be a mistake
> to say it should be.
>
> Also: Remember the days before live CDs? Back then, about 3+ years ago,
> we didn't have any problems asking people to download a whopping six
> CDs..
>
> F13 will be released in 2010.
>
> David
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 15:37:43 -0500 (EST)
> From: Seth Vidal <skvidal at fedoraproject.org<http://mc/compose?to=skvidal@fedoraproject.org>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <alpine.LFD..2.00.0911051536440.9192 at localhost.localdomain<http://mc/compose?to=alpine.LFD.2.00.0911051536440.9192@localhost.localdomain>
> >
> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
>
>
>
> On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, David Zeuthen wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 11:55 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
> >> Personally I think one of the nice things about a live CD image is it
> >> creates a good restriction for building a nice focused working system in
> >> a reasonable amount of space. 1GB would more or less keep that; 2GB is
> >> starting to introduce an awful lot of wiggle room for not caring about
> >> including useless crap.
> >
> > Nah, this is a bad reason - and if it's the case we're already doomed.
> >
> > (FWIW, I don't think it's the case - I trust Matthias and other Live CD
> > desktop maintainers to put only sensible stuff on our images.)
> >
> > Also, no-one says we _must_ include useless crap or even use all of the
> > space. And no-one says the space we're going to use is to be used for
> > software. I've advocated earlier that we should try and promote things
> > like Ogg Theora. For example, we could include
> >
> > http://www.bigbuckbunny.org/
> >
> > on the media. In my view, that would make Fedora a lot more appealing.
> >
> >> And remember, large USB keys may be cheap as chips nowadays but
> >> bandwidth ain't, always. Aren't there still people in Australia with
> >> absurd caps like 10GB/month?
> >
> > They do have mirrors in Australia.
> >
> >> I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> >> functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> >> image 2GB big'.
> >
> > No one says the desktop image should be "our smallest
> > 'complete-out-of-the-box' image". In fact, I think it would be a mistake
> > to say it should be.
> >
> > Also: Remember the days before live CDs? Back then, about 3+ years ago,
> > we didn't have any problems asking people to download a whopping six
> > CDs.
> >
>
> Well, to be fair we didn't tell them download 6 cds. We told them, if they
> were bandwidth-restricted to download the boot.iso and boot and install
> via the net talking to a local mirror.
>
>
> not disputing any other points - but it's not like the super-small image
> has ever been 6-cds.
>
> -sv
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 21:47:02 +0100
> From: Lars Herrmann <herrmann at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=herrmann@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257454022.3222.8636.camel at x61.sulz<http://mc/compose?to=1257454022.3222.8636.camel@x61.sulz>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain
>
> Am Donnerstag, den 05.11.2009, 14:56 -0500 schrieb Matthias Clasen:
> > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 11:55 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
> >
> > > I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> > > functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> > > image 2GB big'.
> > >
> >
> > The biggest gap in terms of 'complete-out-of-the-box' is OpenOffice.
> > Including that brings us up to around 850M or so.
>
> But isn't this just because of the 3 million language packages
> provided ? Could the size kept small by providing uni-language or
> language-group spins ?
>
> Just a thought
>
> Lars
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 15:50:01 -0500
> From: Bill Nottingham <notting at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=notting@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <20091105205000.GA2428 at nostromo.devel.redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=20091105205000..GA2428@nostromo.devel.redhat.com>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Lars Herrmann (herrmann at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=herrmann@redhat.com>)
> said:
> > But isn't this just because of the 3 million language packages
> > provided ? Could the size kept small by providing uni-language or
> > language-group spins ?
>
> That explodes the testing matrix, though. (And makes something
> that needs to support some superset of languages a mess.)
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 21:50:17 +0100
> From: drago01 <drago01 at gmail.com <http://mc/compose?to=drago01@gmail.com>>
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID:
> <f6ca9fed0911051250y76f42f9ap7dc230eed7c687fe at mail.gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=f6ca9fed0911051250y76f42f9ap7dc230eed7c687fe@mail.gmail.com>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 9:47 PM, Lars Herrmann <herrmann at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=herrmann@redhat.com>>
> wrote:
> > Am Donnerstag, den 05.11.2009, 14:56 -0500 schrieb Matthias Clasen:
> >> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 11:55 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
> >>
> >> > I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> >> > functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> >> > image 2GB big'.
> >> >
> >>
> >> The biggest gap in terms of 'complete-out-of-the-box' is OpenOffice.
> >> Including that brings us up to around 850M or so.
> >
> > But isn't this just because of the 3 million language packages
> > provided ? Could the size kept small by providing uni-language or
> > language-group spins ?
> >
> > Just a thought
>
> Asking users to install random language packs isn't a good user
> experience, and if the only reason for that is "we still don't
> acknowledge that we are in the 21st century ...."
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 15:52:28 -0500
> From: David Zeuthen <davidz at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=davidz@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257454348.17978.16.camel at localhost.localdomain<http://mc/compose?to=1257454348.17978.16.camel@localhost.localdomain>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 15:37 -0500, Seth Vidal wrote:
> > > Also: Remember the days before live CDs? Back then, about 3+ years ago,
> > > we didn't have any problems asking people to download a whopping six
> > > CDs.
> > >
> >
> > Well, to be fair we didn't tell them download 6 cds. We told them, if
> they
> > were bandwidth-restricted to download the boot.iso and boot and install
> > via the net talking to a local mirror.
>
> Right, that's true. I remember doing that a lot. IIRC, if choosing a
> minimal install the first two CDs would suffice (if the stars were
> properly aligned I think - ISTR that it broke at one point).
>
> Anyway, people can still do that, right? (honest question, not trolling.
> I don't really know; these days I never use anything but the Live CD to
> install.)
>
> Thanks,
> David
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 15:56:22 -0500 (EST)
> From: Seth Vidal <skvidal at fedoraproject.org<http://mc/compose?to=skvidal@fedoraproject.org>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.00.0911051556170.9192 at localhost.localdomain<http://mc/compose?to=alpine.LFD.2.00.0911051556170.9192@localhost.localdomain>
> >
> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
>
>
>
> On Thu, 5 Nov 2009, David Zeuthen wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 15:37 -0500, Seth Vidal wrote:
> >>> Also: Remember the days before live CDs? Back then, about 3+ years ago,
> >>> we didn't have any problems asking people to download a whopping six
> >>> CDs.
> >>>
> >>
> >> Well, to be fair we didn't tell them download 6 cds. We told them, if
> they
> >> were bandwidth-restricted to download the boot.iso and boot and install
> >> via the net talking to a local mirror.
> >
> > Right, that's true. I remember doing that a lot. IIRC, if choosing a
> > minimal install the first two CDs would suffice (if the stars were
> > properly aligned I think - ISTR that it broke at one point).
> >
> > Anyway, people can still do that, right? (honest question, not trolling.
> > I don't really know; these days I never use anything but the Live CD to
> > install.)
>
> yep. In f11 it's called netinst.
>
> Fedora-11-i386-netinst..iso
>
> for example.
>
> it's 177MB. Which is pretty light weight. It has stage2 on it iirc.
>
> -sv
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 21:58:45 +0100
> From: Lars Herrmann <herrmann at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=herrmann@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257454725.3222.8695.camel at x61.sulz<http://mc/compose?to=1257454725.3222.8695.camel@x61.sulz>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain
>
> Am Donnerstag, den 05.11.2009, 21:50 +0100 schrieb drago01:
> > On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 9:47 PM, Lars Herrmann <herrmann at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=herrmann@redhat.com>>
> wrote:
> > > Am Donnerstag, den 05.11.2009, 14:56 -0500 schrieb Matthias Clasen:
> > >> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 11:55 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> > >> > functional live image and make our smallest
> 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> > >> > image 2GB big'.
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >> The biggest gap in terms of 'complete-out-of-the-box' is OpenOffice.
> > >> Including that brings us up to around 850M or so.
> > >
> > > But isn't this just because of the 3 million language packages
> > > provided ? Could the size kept small by providing uni-language or
> > > language-group spins ?
> > >
> > > Just a thought
> >
> > Asking users to install random language packs isn't a good user
> > experience, and if the only reason for that is "we still don't
> > acknowledge that we are in the 21st century ...."
> >
>
> The point is that it in fact *is* annoying that a significant chunk of
> space goes to totally irrelevant packages. I am typically installing 3
> languages on my system and I am sure this represents a tiny fraction of
> the user base. North of 90% will never ever use more than one language.
> And they will know which one they need prior to downloading ;)
>
> Having a button in the distro to "add a language" is a useful feature
> anyway - it's a bit of a pain today if you want to add a language later
> and have to find out which packages to add. Same goes for removing.
>
> But I'm not aware of all implications of course ...
>
> Lars
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 16:20:30 -0500
> From: Matthias Clasen <mclasen at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=mclasen@redhat.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <1257456030.2589.0.camel at planemask>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 21:47 +0100, Lars Herrmann wrote:
> > Am Donnerstag, den 05.11.2009, 14:56 -0500 schrieb Matthias Clasen:
> > > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 11:55 -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
> > >
> > > > I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> > > > functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> > > > image 2GB big'.
> > > >
> > >
> > > The biggest gap in terms of 'complete-out-of-the-box' is OpenOffice.
> > > Including that brings us up to around 850M or so.
> >
> > But isn't this just because of the 3 million language packages
> > provided ? Could the size kept small by providing uni-language or
> > language-group spins ?
> >
> > Just a thought
> >
>
> I did that experiment back in August. Here is what I wrote back then:
>
> > Replacing abiword with the entire openoffice suite blows the iso
> > size up to 825M.
> >
> > Replacing abiword with just oowriter still blows the iso size up
> > to 820M.
> >
> > This is without any openoffice lang packs.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 17:56:29 -0500
> From: "Paul W. Frields" <stickster at gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=stickster@gmail.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> Message-ID: <20091105225629.GC2894 at victoria.internal.frields.org<http://mc/compose?to=20091105225629.GC2894@victoria.internal.frields.org>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> On Thu, Nov 05, 2009 at 01:35:26PM -0500, David Zeuthen wrote:
> > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 13:24 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote:
> > > David Zeuthen (davidz at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=davidz@redhat.com>)
> said:
> > > > On Thu, 2009-11-05 at 14:33 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> > > > > The image size is 1022 M.
> > > >
> > > > This is likely too big, remember drive manufacturers don't really use
> > > > units like KiB MiB or GiB - they use 1K = 1000, 1M = 1,000,000 and 1G
> =
> > > > 1,000,000,000 - e.g. the SI units.
> > > >
> > > > It seems to me that most 1GB USB keys have a size of 1GB = 1,000M =
> > > > 1,000,000,000 bytes. Some are 1024MB (1024,000,000,000 bytes), some
> may
> > > > be a bit smaller (e.g. "value-adds" like the Sandisk U3 "CD-ROM")
> while
> > > > some may actually be 1024 MiB (1,099,511,627,776 bytes). It varies.
> > >
> > > Moreover, the closer you get to the full size, the less space you'll
> > > have for any overlay.
> >
> > Good point. A quick search on the Internet suggests that 2GB sticks can
> > be had for < $10. So maybe we should just bite the bullet and target 2GB
> > keys and do a 1.7GB (1,700,000,000 bytes) image leaving ~300MB free for
> > the overlay.
> >
> > Then leaves both wiggle-room and also enables us to include *compelling*
> > stuff like Ogg Theora videos featuring Shadowman etc etc.
>
> The price differences between 1GB and 2GB sticks seem minimal (and you
> can find some 2GB cheaper than 1GB, of course). I lobbied purposely
> with the Red Hat Summit organizers to make sure we gave out Fedora on
> 2GB keys so that we could have a sizable key.
>
> --
> Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/
> gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717
> http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/
> irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 11:10:14 +0200
> From: Nicu Buculei <nicu_fedora at nicubunu.ro<http://mc/compose?to=nicu_fedora@nicubunu.ro>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID: <4AF3E7F6.9070106 at nicubunu.ro<http://mc/compose?to=4AF3E7F6.9070106@nicubunu.ro>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
> On 11/05/2009 10:34 PM, David Zeuthen wrote:
> >
> > Also, no-one says we _must_ include useless crap or even use all of the
> > space. And no-one says the space we're going to use is to be used for
> > software. I've advocated earlier that we should try and promote things
> > like Ogg Theora. For example, we could include
> >
> > http://www.bigbuckbunny.org/
>
> + 1 million
>
> >
> >> I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> >> functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> >> image 2GB big'.
> >
> > No one says the desktop image should be "our smallest
> > 'complete-out-of-the-box' image". In fact, I think it would be a mistake
> > to say it should be.
>
> How about a middle ground? Most of the people will just try and see what
> is about, they will not use write overlay, so we can target the image at
> 1 GB (999 MB), to cover their case. Advanced users, who will made use of
> the write overlay, will surely write the image on a 2GB or large drive,
> having the option to set the overlay as large as they want and the
> possibility to throw in other useful things, like a persistent home.
>
> --
> nicu :: http://nicubunu.ro :: http://nicubunu.blogspot.com/
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2009 18:10:16 +0530
> From: onkar mirajkar <odmirajkar at gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=odmirajkar@gmail.com>
> >
> Subject: Re: Desktop Live DVD: diff
> To: Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop
> <fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> >
> Message-ID:
> <3492acc30911060440m48a62286qf58f18beec83b46d at mail.gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=3492acc30911060440m48a62286qf58f18beec83b46d@mail.gmail.com>
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi,
> Few days back I created a Ubnutu live USB. But I recognize that its not
> good
> for my day to day use as it doesnot allow me to add my own packages like
> VLC.
> Is this a general problem with all Live USB as there are live dvd creator
> which allows me to add my own packages.
> I think its good idea to add this feature as USB is read wirte device not
> read only like DVD so that user can install their own software and
> customize
> thier live USB.
> Thanks,
> Onkar
>
>
>
> 2009/11/6 Nicu Buculei <nicu_fedora at nicubunu.ro<http://mc/compose?to=nicu_fedora@nicubunu.ro>
> >
>
> > On 11/05/2009 10:34 PM, David Zeuthen wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Also, no-one says we _must_ include useless crap or even use all of the
> >> space. And no-one says the space we're going to use is to be used for
> >> software. I've advocated earlier that we should try and promote things
> >> like Ogg Theora. For example, we could include
> >>
> >> http://www.bigbuckbunny.org/
> >>
> >
> > + 1 million
> >
> >
> >
> >> I'm not sure I like the idea, if the idea is 'stop doing a small
> >>> functional live image and make our smallest 'complete-out-of-the-box'
> >>> image 2GB big'.
> >>>
> >>
> >> No one says the desktop image should be "our smallest
> >> 'complete-out-of-the-box' image". In fact, I think it would be a mistake
> >> to say it should be.
> >>
> >
> > How about a middle ground? Most of the people will just try and see what
> is
> > about, they will not use write overlay, so we can target the image at 1
> GB
> > (999 MB), to cover their case. Advanced users, who will made use of the
> > write overlay, will surely write the image on a 2GB or large drive,
> having
> > the option to set the overlay as large as they want and the possibility
> to
> > throw in other useful things, like a persistent home.
> >
> > --
> > nicu :: http://nicubunu.ro :: http://nicubunu.blogspot.com/
> >
> >
> > --
> > Fedora-desktop-list mailing list
> > Fedora-desktop-list at redhat.com<http://mc/compose?to=Fedora-desktop-list@redhat.com>
> > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-desktop-list
> >
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