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Re: X on tty1 in Rawhide/F10

Les Mikesell wrote:
Casey Dahlin wrote:

Who does this affect?
1) People using the console a lot who also run X (remember, runlevel 3 hasn't changed). Desktop users don't use consoles, server users don't use X (I hope). Only a few species of geek remain.

This dichotomy exists only in your imagination. Desktop users sometimes interact with servers, server users nearly always interact with desktops.

The users are the same. The computers, however, are different.

The user is the one that needs consistency.

Ctrl+Alt+F1 brings up the primary user interface. Sounds consistent to me.

2) People recovering from X crashes. Bugs. Errors. Things we could be fixing and making not happen rather than accommodating this bizzare F1 fetish.

People reading documentation. Please change the behavior _after_ updating all existing documentation.

Documentation changes need to go out /at/ the time of change. Not before, not after (though they do need to be prepared ahead of time). I know for the documentation we control the effort will be made to keep that up to date. There's been a recent influx of new contributors recently that care about this area a lot and are doing their best.

But you find documentation by doing a google search. How do you plan to replace all of that, along with the memory of people who read it earlier?

You're right. Stop the release, we need to ship Red Hat 7.3 instead.
For documentation we don't control, well, there will always be issues.

I should also point out that for people that know about VTs, the mental fallback pattern probably handles this well. *Ctrl+Alt+F1* "Huh?" *Ctrl+Alt+F1* "What the..." *Ctrl+Alt+F2* "Hmm, that's weird" *Ctrl+Alt+F1* "Oh, ok."

Yes, that might be a reasonable description of someone's encounter with fedora. At least someone who is already used to the inability to stick to a user interface. But is that the way you want people to respond to an operating system - punch keys at random until something appears to work?
People have more in common with chimpanzees than you realize.


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