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Re: Package Review Stats for the week ending January 18th, 2009



Christoph Wickert wrote:
> Am Mittwoch, den 28.01.2009, 21:10 -0500 schrieb Behdad Esfahbod:
>> Robert Scheck wrote:
>>> But mostly the Red Hat guys are lacking massive
>>> RPM knowledge and ignore Guidelines [snip].
>> Can we please be done with this kind of blanket statements as well as "Red Hat
>> vs the community" comments?  They are derogatory, demoralizing, and border on
>> offensive.  And after the third time, simply frustrating.  Red Hat has some of
>> the best engineers in the world, perhaps some of the worst if you wish, and
>> most probably a lot of average ones.  So what?
> 
> I think what Robert and me wanted to express is: It's not only that some
> (!) people from RH do not follow the guidelines but some also explicitly
> refuse to follow them even after they were told them what's wrong. I
> have no explanation for that kind of behavior but arrogance. 

I have a very unpleasant experience with a community maintainer over a package
we co-maintained and that I'm the upstream.  Do I extrapolate that to all
non-RH people?  No.  Stop discriminating already.  If an RH person doesn't
follow Fedora rules and guidelines, follow the standard Fedora procedures to
deal with them.  Stop whining.  Please.


>> Most of what is seen as "Red Hat guys are bad at packaging" is simply baggage
>> held from the Core days.  
> 
> Agreed, but we've had merge reviews with proposals for enhancements and
> fixes that did not get applied by the owner. I have never ever seen this
> from a community member. If someone did, his review request would be
> closed "WONTFIX" pretty soon, but this isn't possible for merge reviews.

Sure.  That's a problem with the merge review procedure perhaps?  Definitely
not something to blame the poor RH developer for.  I still have many merge
reviews unresolved.  Am I blocking them?  Hell no.  Go ahead and complete
them.  I'll give you full maintainership if you need.  As I said a couple
months ago, just because I work for Red Hat doesn't mean Fedora procedures get
to decide what I work on.


>> Unfortunately (for us "Red Hat guys") most Core
>> packages were simply thrown upon us as part of our job.  I would never
>> *volunteer* to do packaging, as that's not what I'm best at.  
> 
> Does that mean you are expecting someone who volunteers for something to
> do it better than someone who has do to it because he get's paid for? I
> can not follow that argument and I doubt your employer will.

If I don't like what I'm doing, I'll do a very shitty job at it.  If I
wouldn't volunteer for something, chances are high that I don't like it.  My
manager and my employer fully understand those two facts.


>> If someone wants
>> to go ahead and take maintainership of all my packages, I very well appreciate
>> it.  I'm sure many other "Red Hat guys" are in the same boat.
> 
> This is what I call a constructive suggestion. ;)

Now wait and see how much real change that makes.  That's the problem...

behdad


> Regards,
> Christoph
> 
>> behdad
>> proud Red Hat employee, poor package maintainer, RPM n00b.


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