Fedora-websites-list Digest, Vol 34, Issue 14

[Adam Humphreys]

My experience as a web architect in a similar CMS interactive environment
like this was to first implement a bug tracker system, and then work in
priority sequence to what the site structure needed through out the ongoing
development cycle. Since the people are the voice of Fedora it only makes
sense to add a secure API that users can easily add in their concerns with
out making it too difficult.The best thing I've seen yet is a page that
users could submit their errors, or suggestions to the bottom of the page to
be submitted to the DB for review into the bug tracker.

For the versatile structure requirements of the Fedora CMS I am definitely
also leaning towards Drupal.org. It has an open enough infrastructure to add
in a number of great features and is ported for easy adoption of new
technologies as they come rather than being locked down. Being able to adapt
easily is a big concern as we're facing the movement of the entire
infrastructure onto a new base. I would naturally encourage everyone to keep
looking as there's tons of amazing CMS out there but this one seems to be
the best fit I've seen so far. Adopting ajax menu's for suggestions as
people entered in key words would be an asset to keeping the system more
efficient, and  getting results simple for users. I'm pretty sure we can all
agree that keeping things organized is the easiest way to maintain the site.

Adam J. Humphreys

On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 7:44 PM, <fedora-websites-list-request at redhat.com>wrote:

> Send Fedora-websites-list mailing list submissions to
>        fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>        https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>        fedora-websites-list-request at redhat.com
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>        fedora-websites-list-owner at redhat.com
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Fedora-websites-list digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: one CMS (Ricky Zhou)
>   2. Re: need help (Karsten 'quaid' Wade)
>   3. CMS eliminators (Stephen John Smoogen)
>   4. Re: CMS eliminators (Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams)
>   5. Re: one CMS (Karsten 'quaid' Wade)
>   6. Re: one CMS (Karsten 'quaid' Wade)
>   7. Re: CMS eliminators (Karsten 'quaid' Wade)
>   8. Re: one CMS (Ricky Zhou)
>   9. Re: Websites Meetings (Craig Thomas)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 13:34:55 -0400
> From: Ricky Zhou <ricky at fedoraproject.org>
> Subject: Re: one CMS
> To: fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> Message-ID: <20080814173455.GA19863 at Max>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> On 2008-08-13 04:01:35 PM, Karsten 'quaid' Wade wrote:
> > We need one CMS solution (for sanity sake), although >1 install might be
> > OK(?), to cover:
> >
> > * fedoraproject.org
> > * docs.fedoraproject.org
> If you don't mind, I'd like to focus this discussion on
> docs.fedoraproject.org first - the way I see it, if a CMS won't work for
> docs, then it's not worth using it on fp.o (plus maintaining a
> completely separate setup for docs).
>
> The one main requirement (featurewise) from fp.o would be not breaking
> translator workflows.  What features/use cases does docs need/want?
>
> Thanks,
> Ricky
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: not available
> Type: application/pgp-signature
> Size: 197 bytes
> Desc: not available
> Url :
> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/attachments/20080814/b78b224e/attachment.bin
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 11:43:15 -0700
> From: "Karsten 'quaid' Wade" <kwade at redhat.com>
> Subject: Re: need help
> To: Sean <kilpatms at speakeasy.net>, webmaster
>        <webmaster at fedoraproject.org>
> Message-ID: <1218739395.31796.6.camel at calliope.phig.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
> On Thu, 2008-08-14 at 14:19 -0400, Sean wrote:
>
> > I have tried the FAQs and the FEdora Project wiki without success.
>
> Recommend you try fedora-list or #fedora:
>
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate#User_Mailing_Lists
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate#IRC
>
> - Karsten
> --
> Karsten Wade, Sr. Developer Community Mgr.
> Dev Fu : http://developer.redhatmagazine.com
> Fedora : http://quaid.fedorapeople.org
> gpg key : AD0E0C41
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: not available
> Type: application/pgp-signature
> Size: 189 bytes
> Desc: This is a digitally signed message part
> Url :
> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/attachments/20080814/d53c69da/attachment.bin
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 13:48:46 -0600
> From: "Stephen John Smoogen" <smooge at gmail.com>
> Subject: CMS eliminators
> To: fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> Message-ID:
>        <80d7e4090808141248l26939d5dn6d43b19d74b34c14 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Sadly, one of the first issues in choosing a CMS will be what
> 'language' it is written in. I say sadly because this can also be the
> first of a long seige war where people who believe that embedded COBOL
> is the only way to write a CMS [isn't that what the C stands for] will
> bring it up every couple of weeks. In looking at a CMS, are there
> going to be certain 'languages' that are off the table from the
> beginning? (mod_cobol is probably one).
>
> A year ago, I would have said any CMS written in PHP would have had a
> tough slog onto Fedora infrastructure, but with Mediawiki I think that
> has been put to rest. But it would probably have to be shown that any
> PHP CMS could work with various known to be bad or tough to secure
> features turned off.
>
>
> --
> Stephen J Smoogen. -- BSD/GNU/Linux
> How far that little candle throws his beams! So shines a good deed
> in a naughty world. = Shakespeare. "The Merchant of Venice"
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:38:31 -0400
> From: Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams <ivazqueznet at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: CMS eliminators
> To: fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> Message-ID: <1218749911.11246.57.camel at ignacio.lan>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> On Thu, 2008-08-14 at 13:48 -0600, Stephen John Smoogen wrote:
> > A year ago, I would have said any CMS written in PHP would have had a
> > tough slog onto Fedora infrastructure, but with Mediawiki I think that
> > has been put to rest. But it would probably have to be shown that any
> > PHP CMS could work with various known to be bad or tough to secure
> > features turned off.
>
> There is drupy, but I don't know if it's in a usable state yet.
>
> http://drupy.net/
>
> --
> Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams <ivazqueznet at gmail.com>
>
> PLEASE don't CC me; I'm already subscribed
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: not available
> Type: application/pgp-signature
> Size: 189 bytes
> Desc: This is a digitally signed message part
> Url :
> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/attachments/20080814/5d061c2a/attachment.bin
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 15:19:44 -0700
> From: "Karsten 'quaid' Wade" <kwade at redhat.com>
> Subject: Re: one CMS
> To: fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> Message-ID: <1218752384.31796.14.camel at calliope.phig.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
> On Thu, 2008-08-14 at 13:34 -0400, Ricky Zhou wrote:
> > On 2008-08-13 04:01:35 PM, Karsten 'quaid' Wade wrote:
> > > We need one CMS solution (for sanity sake), although >1 install might
> be
> > > OK(?), to cover:
> > >
> > > * fedoraproject.org
> > > * docs.fedoraproject.org
> > If you don't mind, I'd like to focus this discussion on
> > docs.fedoraproject.org first - the way I see it, if a CMS won't work for
> > docs, then it's not worth using it on fp.o (plus maintaining a
> > completely separate setup for docs).
> >
> > The one main requirement (featurewise) from fp.o would be not breaking
> > translator workflows.  What features/use cases does docs need/want?
>
> You are totally correct.  My reason for jamming it together was to
> capture and move one-time the various ACL'd pages in the wiki.  Another
> option we've discussed previously is to move them to e.g. Packaging:
> namespace.  Then we have to re-jiggle the default search, etc.  But it
> is far less disruptive.
>
> Ideally we'd match or improve the l10n workflow, such as by kicking out
> PO files from the CMS in to Transifex.
>
> - Karsten
> --
> Karsten Wade, Sr. Developer Community Mgr.
> Dev Fu : http://developer.redhatmagazine.com
> Fedora : http://quaid.fedorapeople.org
> gpg key : AD0E0C41
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: not available
> Type: application/pgp-signature
> Size: 189 bytes
> Desc: This is a digitally signed message part
> Url :
> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/attachments/20080814/f4782c36/attachment.bin
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 15:30:17 -0700
> From: "Karsten 'quaid' Wade" <kwade at redhat.com>
> Subject: Re: one CMS
> To: fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> Message-ID: <1218753017.31796.19.camel at calliope.phig.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
> On Thu, 2008-08-14 at 09:49 -0500, Yannick Lyn Fatt wrote:
>
> >
> > What about Drupal? http://www.drupal.org
>
> Drupal is certainly a fine CMS, filled with features, and has a strong
> community as well as commercial presence.
>
> In this discussion, we want to be careful of putting the cart before the
> horse, an expression that means in this context, "Let's first figure out
> what features we need and don't need, then we'll work on which tool fits
> those features best."
>
> - Karsten
> --
> Karsten Wade, Sr. Developer Community Mgr.
> Dev Fu : http://developer.redhatmagazine.com
> Fedora : http://quaid.fedorapeople.org
> gpg key : AD0E0C41
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: not available
> Type: application/pgp-signature
> Size: 189 bytes
> Desc: This is a digitally signed message part
> Url :
> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/attachments/20080814/f1a469b3/attachment.bin
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 15:35:44 -0700
> From: "Karsten 'quaid' Wade" <kwade at redhat.com>
> Subject: Re: CMS eliminators
> To: fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> Message-ID: <1218753344.31796.25.camel at calliope.phig.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
> On Thu, 2008-08-14 at 13:48 -0600, Stephen John Smoogen wrote:
> > Sadly, one of the first issues in choosing a CMS will be what
> > 'language' it is written in. I say sadly because this can also be the
> > first of a long seige war where people who believe that embedded COBOL
> > is the only way to write a CMS [isn't that what the C stands for] will
> > bring it up every couple of weeks. In looking at a CMS, are there
> > going to be certain 'languages' that are off the table from the
> > beginning? (mod_cobol is probably one).
> >
> > A year ago, I would have said any CMS written in PHP would have had a
> > tough slog onto Fedora infrastructure, but with Mediawiki I think that
> > has been put to rest. But it would probably have to be shown that any
> > PHP CMS could work with various known to be bad or tough to secure
> > features turned off.
>
> Security history and responsiveness is pretty high on the list.  I
> presume we can express that to cover language, if needed.  We can put up
> features such as, "Written on modern technology with a vibrant community
> and likelihood of being popular beyond the next twelve months."
>
> But, yes, I think the days of something being off the list entirely
> because of language should be over.
>
> One reason is the way popular tools and languages draw in more
> contributors to Infrastructure and Websites.  By my count, we picked up
> a couple of kick-ass contributors just in moving to MediaWiki.  I expect
> if we pick another popular CMS, even PHP based :D, we'll see a similar
> intake of new talent who are passionate about the $CMS and are ready to
> be part of the larger Fedoraverse.
>
> - Karsten
> --
> Karsten Wade, Sr. Developer Community Mgr.
> Dev Fu : http://developer.redhatmagazine.com
> Fedora : http://quaid.fedorapeople.org
> gpg key : AD0E0C41
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: not available
> Type: application/pgp-signature
> Size: 189 bytes
> Desc: This is a digitally signed message part
> Url :
> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/attachments/20080814/d76dd521/attachment.bin
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 19:09:39 -0400
> From: Ricky Zhou <ricky at fedoraproject.org>
> Subject: Re: one CMS
> To: fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> Message-ID: <20080814230939.GA4264 at Max>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> On 2008-08-14 03:19:44 PM, Karsten 'quaid' Wade wrote:
> > You are totally correct.  My reason for jamming it together was to
> > capture and move one-time the various ACL'd pages in the wiki.  Another
> > option we've discussed previously is to move them to e.g. Packaging:
> > namespace.  Then we have to re-jiggle the default search, etc.  But it
> > is far less disruptive.
> Ah, that makes sense - so we can add fine-grained ACLs to the list of
> stuff to want, then hopefully focus on docs's publishing workflow needs.
> I don't know if we want to move both at the same time, though.  I'd
> *hate* to end up using anything for the website that docs would not end
> up using long term as well.
>
> Either way, I'm just bringing this up in the context of finding good
> candidates.  Just something to keep in mind when listing features that
> we'd want in a CMS.
>
> Thanks,
> Ricky
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: not available
> Type: application/pgp-signature
> Size: 197 bytes
> Desc: not available
> Url :
> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/attachments/20080814/cf214084/attachment.bin
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 19:44:22 -0400
> From: "Craig Thomas" <bicycle.nutz at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: Websites Meetings
> To: fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> Message-ID:
>        <dcfb610d0808141644x35c5372fw131803da37e05044 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 2:30 PM, Max Spevack <mspevack at redhat.com> wrote:
> > I'm taking my summer vacation starting tonight, and I won't be back until
> > next Wednesday, so I'll be missing both of these meetings.
>
> Hi all,
>
> I have recently returned to the world from same :)
>
> >
> > Which brings me to a larger topic:
> >
> > A couple of months ago when Mike McGrath asked someone to start holding
> > Websites meetings regularly, I volunteered because I wanted to step in
> and
> > fill a need.  But as you all know, I am not deeply active in the day to
> day
> > coding or design that goes on in Fedora Websites.  It was always the
> > objective that once some momentum had been built up, and there were a
> number
> > of tasks being worked through, that "leadership" of the Websites project
> > could transfer to someone in the community who wanted to step into that
> > role.
> >
> > Are we ready for that yet?  Is anyone feeling inspired?
>
> I am surprised no one responded to this post, and I don't think we are
> there yet. Inspiration is only part of the puzzle for me, time is the
> major factor ( i can barley make the meetings you are running :), and
> I am sure that is true of others.  Growing a bit more couldn't hurt.
> Anyway, to your plan...
>
> > Here's the critical path, IMHO:
> >
> > (1) get-fedora into F10 shape, and incorporating a link to (2), below.
>
> My name is next to this one and I am not sure what our plan is? what
> are we planning to do to improve this? I am happy to work on anything
> we decide on/want to see, offer opinions or do mockups...Let's make
> 'getting fedora' better. I have read this, but I am not sure what we
> want to do for the user to make it better:
>
>
> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/2008-June/msg00231.html
>
> > (2) spins.fp.o into small, achievable milestones.  The first milestone,
> > IMHO, needs to be a "spin information page" which contains basic
> information
> > about the spin, a .ks and a link to torrents, ISOs (wherever they are
> > hosted), or other download mechanisms.  The second milestone is a basic
> > index of all spins.  The third milestone is workflow to automate the
> > addition and deletion of spins from the index.
>
> > (3) Finding, developing, and recruiting people who are interested in web
> > application development.  Making it as SIMPLE AS POSSIBLE for someone to
> > have a turbogears application, with Fedora look and feel, up and running
> on
> > a test instance somewhere in our infrastructure.
> >
> > (4) Respond to whatever comes up on a weekly basis that needs attention.
> >
> > That's my little roadmap.  What do y'all think?
>
> I think it's the right path, and I think we still need you to bust
> trail :)  I will bring up item 1 in the next meeting, but don't know
> anything about 2 other than it was to be a web app of sorts, and not
> just a set of static pages.
>
> my $.02
>
> --
> Craig
>
> >
> > --Max
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> --
> Fedora-websites-list mailing list
> Fedora-websites-list at redhat.com
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-websites-list
>
>
> End of Fedora-websites-list Digest, Vol 34, Issue 14
> ****************************************************
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listman.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/attachments/20080818/8888466e/attachment.htm>