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"Default" spin of Fedora

The redesign mockups by Juan Camilo Prada 
(http://juankprada.livejournal.com/7682.html) raised 2 important issues for 
which this is apparently the right venue for discussion, so let me state 

1. Do we really want to highlight a "default" spin on the front page, 
effectively hiding the others? While I realize the niceness of being able to 
download Fedora in one click from the fedoraproject.org front page, this 
means many users (in particular, exactly those targeted by this convenience 
measure) will miss the fact that the others even exist. We already do a very 
bad job of advertising all the possible ways of installing Fedora (e.g. 
network and HDD installs), hiding 2 of the 3 main ways to install Fedora 
(DVD, GNOME "Desktop" Live CD, KDE Live CD) will only make this worse. :-(

2. Assuming the answer to "1." is "yes", I think the installer DVD would be a 
much better default than the GNOME-only Desktop Live spin, for several 
* Live CDs cannot be used to upgrade existing Fedora installations (without 
reinstalling from scratch, which is often not possible without deleting user 
data), the installer DVD can. Attempts to upgrade from a live CD can even 
lead to data loss (if the user doesn't realize this fact), IIRC this has 
already happened at least once to someone on the mailing lists.
* As the name says, Desktop Live is only targeted at the desktop, whereas the 
DVD also contains some server and development packages.
* The installer DVD also contains popular desktop applications such as 
OpenOffice.org which are not included on the live images for space reasons.
* Desktop Live is GNOME-only, the installer DVD contains both GNOME and KDE. 
That's why there are 2 main live CD images, the DVD is a nice compromise, 
whereas defaulting to a GNOME-only spin really sends a message that we don't 
care about KDE. :-( As one of the KDE maintainers in Fedora, I consider it 
really unacceptable that my work gets hidden under the carpet that way, while 
a GNOME-only spin gets presented on the silver plate. There are far more 
Fedora KDE users than some of you would expect, do you really want to 
alienate that huge part of your user base? (Now, I also think the installer 
DVD should make it easier to select KDE, not just through the custom package 
selection for advanced users, but that's off topic for this list, and the 
point still stands that with the DVD, at least you _can_ select KDE.)
* Most computers these days have DVD drives.
* The installer DVD is the actual "Fedora" spin. :-) (And considering all of 
the above points, I'm definitely not suggesting changing that.)

By the way, while only partly related, there's one more thing which I think 
could really be improved: it should be made more clear that the Desktop spin 
is GNOME-based (i.e. includes GNOME as its only desktop environment). Right 
now, only the GNOME foot in the icon is a subtle hint at that and can be 
easily missed. This is a disservice to users of KDE (and XFCE, too) who may 
be misled into downloading a spin which does not contain the desktop 
environment they intend to run. Some possible solutions (while still keeping 
the "Desktop Live" name, which as I understand it is set in stone, even if I 
disagree with it for the same reasons):
* changing the heading to "Desktop Live (GNOME-based)"
* keeping just "Desktop Live" as the heading, but adding a one-sentence 
description for every spin (as in Juank's mockup) and mentioning GNOME in the 
description of "Desktop Live"
I'm open to other solutions as long as they make the word "GNOME" appear in a 
noticeable way next to the "Desktop Live" spin.

        Kevin Kofler

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