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Meeting Log - 2008-05-08



18:59 -!- ricky changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Websites -- Who's here?
18:59 -!- JonRob [n=jon exhalls-3 ex ac uk] has joined #fedora-meeting
18:59  * giarc +1
18:59  * ianweller 
19:00  * ricky 
19:00 -!- mbonnet is now known as mbonnet_
19:00 < JonRob> right...let's get this started
19:00 < JonRob> <meeting>
19:01 < JonRob> sorry if you've already done this, but can i get a quick show of hands who's here?
19:01 < ricky> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/2008-May/msg00088.html
19:01  * ianweller 
19:01  * ricky 
19:01 < JonRob> make my minute taking a little easier :)
19:01  * giarc :)
19:01  * juank_prada jumps
19:02 < JonRob> ok, looks like it's just us for the time being, i think mmcgrath said he'd be along at some point
19:02 < ianweller> mmcgrath: ping
19:02 < ianweller> oh already done by ricky
19:03 < JonRob> i think we can hopefully quickly cover the first item on the agenda
19:03 < JonRob> so let's see how we go with that
19:03 < JonRob> how are things progressing on the websites front for the f9 launch?
19:03 < ricky> So at this point, what's on http://publictest10.fedoraproject.org/ should pretty much turn out to be the F9 site
19:04 < JonRob> ricky: are we going to go with mo's banner?
19:04 < ricky> Strings are pretty much frozen, and we're waiting for translations.
19:04 < giarc> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/PromoBanners?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=fedora9_0day_banner.png
19:04 < ricky> JonRob: Oops, yes.  That doesn't involve strings, so it'll be safe.
19:04 < JonRob> giarc: thanks that's what i was just trying to find!
19:04 < JonRob> has everyone seen it?
19:04 < ricky> Well, the alt text will probably just be "Fedora 9"
19:05 < JonRob> ricky, sounds safe to me
19:05 < ianweller> i like that banner
19:05 < giarc> so, that goes on the home page, in place of the three images we have there now ?
19:05 < JonRob> giarc: right
19:05 < ricky> Yup
19:05 < giarc> cool
19:06 < JonRob> ricky, do you have anything else you'd like to cover here? anything you need help with or extra hands?
19:06 < ricky> Nothing too much - yesterday, we talked a bit about getting website things together for F9
19:07 < ricky> get.fp.o and join.fp.o will probably be the canonical links to give out
19:07 < JonRob> yeah...mktg has that covered i believe
19:07 < ricky> (That'll be communicated with marketing as well)
19:07 < JonRob> paul has sent a message out
19:07 < ricky> Excellent
19:07 < JonRob> to let everyone know
19:07 -!- stickster_afk is now known as stickster
19:07 -!- wolfy [n=lonewolf fedora/wolfy] has left #fedora-meeting ["If everything seems to be going well, you have obviously overlooked something."]
19:07 < JonRob> hopefully we'll get some pretty stats from this release onwards :)
19:08 < JonRob> any objections to me moving things on?
19:08 < JonRob> ok...onwards it is!
19:09 < JonRob> the next item on the agenda is the future of the team again
19:09 < JonRob> max sent an interesting message to the list outlining his vision
19:09 < JonRob> has everyone had a chance to see this?
19:09 < ricky> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/2008-May/msg00088.html
19:09 < JonRob> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/2008-May/msg00088.html
19:09 < ricky> Whoops
19:09 < ianweller> yeah i'm reading it now
19:09 < juank_prada> +1 to spevack's proposal
19:09 < JonRob> ricky - great minds :)
19:09 < ricky> +1 as well, sounds like a very logical separation
19:10 < JonRob> does anyone have any questions or comments they'd like to throw at max about it?
19:10 < JonRob> i know he's not around now
19:10 < giarc> yeah, i think so as well
19:10 < JonRob> but no reason this can't go to the list
19:10 < ianweller> i think it's a well rounded proposal
19:10 < JonRob> ok well people seem positive about it!
19:11 < JonRob> with that in mind
19:11 < JonRob> the next thing we probably need to think about is starting to implement this
19:11 < giarc> it's seems we already have the contacts with most of the other groups
19:11 < giarc> or at least some contact, a point
19:11 < JonRob> girac: yeah, so that's a great start
19:11 < giarc> person for each already
19:12 < giarc> perhaps not spins?
19:12 < JonRob> juank_prada: how's your work going on your new vision for the website that we discussed last time?
19:12 < JonRob> giarc: the spins sig is only just getting going itself
19:12 < ricky> A lot of great get-fedora improvements were posted to list :-)
19:12 < JonRob> so that'll settle in a few weeks i think
19:12 < juank_prada> JonRob: things are going well but still i have some doubts about spins
19:12 < JonRob> ok...well, before we cover that in too much detail
19:13 < JonRob> do you feel happy enough about them to try and start co-ordinating things on the look and feel section?
19:13 < JonRob> we don't need to make rapid progress with any of this, just slow and steady
19:13 < juank_prada> giarc and i have been working on new get-fedora implementation and some things have gone pretty well, people have commented a lot about that and although there is work to do we are heading on a better direction now
19:13 < mmcgrath> pong
19:13 < ricky> juank_prada: What kind of doubts?
19:13 < JonRob> mmcgrath: welcome :)
19:14 < ricky> mmcgrath: Hey :-)
19:14 < JonRob> we're just discussing max's proposal
19:14 < juank_prada> ricky: mi primary concern is how spins are going to be handled
19:14 < mmcgrath> howdy.
19:14 < JonRob> did you see it?
19:14 < juank_prada> we can pretty much set some links to the get-fedora site and let people know a bit about spins and heach one might have a static site that we would be in charge of...
19:15 < mmcgrath> how "big" will that make the page?
19:15 -!- jeremy [n=katzj nat/redhat-us/x-aff7a0665681b852] has joined #fedora-meeting
19:15 < juank_prada> or... we could set a more dynamic site in which spins owners can provide information andwe just leave them a template or a CMS like site in which the can manage the information about their releases
19:16 < ricky> mmcgrath: The get-fedora page or the spins page?
19:16 < mmcgrath> well, either.
19:16 < juank_prada> mmcgrath: that depends
19:16 < ricky> I guess it'd be mostly text in either case.
19:16  * giarc notes we have ~.5 dozen spins
19:17 < giarc> and growing ?
19:17 < JonRob> hopefully growing :)
19:17 < mmcgrath> giarc: I'm not really sure what the plan for that is.
19:17 < juank_prada> if we set just links to download the spins the size of the site wont grow that much... but if what we want is to provide more information in get-fedora things could be much bigger
19:17 < mmcgrath> will it be 10-20?  or will it be 100-200?
19:17 < mmcgrath> I have no idea.
19:17 < giarc> so, it'll take some space to show them all, so the design should accomodate that
19:18 < juank_prada> that was the idea of having Javascript hiding sections of the site
19:18 < ianweller> pagination using AJAX?
19:18 < JonRob> ok all
19:18 < ricky> mmcgrath: I'd guess <100, but that's just a guess.
19:18 < juank_prada> another option is AJAX although ricky asked for a less server side implementation
19:19 < ricky> That and we want it to be bookmarkable
19:19 < juank_prada> yeap
19:19 < giarc> juank_prada, yeah, but 10-12 is way different that even 30 or 40
19:19 < juank_prada> http://craigt.fedorapeople.org/get-fedora-2/get-fedora
19:19 < JonRob> can i just take a moment to focus the conversation a little bit back on the idea of getting ourselves set tasks to focus our attention on?
19:19 -!- stickster is now known as stickster_afk
19:20 < juank_prada> thats the idea that have been on the ml so far probably you have seen it...
19:20 < mmcgrath> ricky: well, imagine all the spins we have now * localizations for each.  Now imagine that the 5 or 6 spins we have now become 15 - 20 spins, each localized...
19:20 < ricky> Oh, I was thinking of per-page size (+- an image or two).
19:20 < giarc> heh, ricky :)
19:21 < JonRob> it seems like there's a lot of energy here for the spins
19:21 -!- ldimaggi_ [n=ldimaggi c-76-19-171-76 hsd1 ma comcast net] has joined #fedora-meeting
19:21 < JonRob> so can i poke somebody into stepping up and taking a bit of a lead in developing this over the coming few weeks
19:21 < JonRob> we're certainly not going to figure it out here in this meeting
19:21 < juank_prada> i saw a comment on the mailing list that seems right, and is that even that we are promoting spins, the "main" product here is the fedora installation media (LiveCD or DVD iso)
19:23 < juank_prada> JonRob: i was suppose to start working on that.. but then those questions poped out and i havent started that just yet
19:23 < ricky> No worries, what kinds of questions do we need to address?
19:23 < JonRob> juank_prada: ok, so can i perhaps set you as a task for the coming week, and let me know if you think this is reasonable
19:23 < juank_prada> JonRob: sure
19:23 < JonRob> to come up with a list of things that we need to tackle to get a spins.fp.o site up
19:24 < JonRob> break it down
19:24 < JonRob> so that way, when we meet back next week
19:24 < JonRob> we've got a concrete set of issues to work through and a definite set of solutions we want to see?
19:24 < JonRob> other people will almost definitely find it easier to help out too :)
19:24 < juank_prada> yeap ... :)
19:25 -!- Bob-Laptop [n=bob fedora/pdpc.sustaining.BobJensen] has joined #Fedora-Meeting
19:25 < juank_prada> ill be asking lots of questions this week as i wont be able to stay here for any longer
19:25 < JonRob> ok, with that in mind, unless people think i'm rushing things a bit, could we take a moment to look at some of the other topics max talked about?
19:25 < JonRob> juank_prada: lots of questions is always good, keeping plenty of it on the list will help to drive interest too
19:25 < JonRob> !
19:26 < juank_prada> ok ill write to the ml instead
19:26 < mmcgrath> no worries, we'll have plenty of other meetings :)
19:26 < juank_prada> see you all next time .. im sorry i cant stay any longer
19:26 < JonRob> np - good luck with the uni stuff
19:26 < giarc> juank_prada, no worries, see you later
19:26 < ricky> See you - thanks for coming
19:27 -!- juank_prada [n=juanky 200 114 38 35] has quit "Leaving"
19:27 < JonRob> ok, ricky and mike: i think we talked a little about this last time, that is websites and infra, and how they interact with each other
19:28 < JonRob> one thing that would be good, and all of this can certainly wait until post release (:p), about coming up with a list of all the fedora owned (sub-)domains and major web-apps?
19:28 < JonRob> or do we have one already?
19:28 < ricky> I think we have a list of sites (/me searches)
19:29 < JonRob> knowing what exists and what the websites team needs to focus on will help in organising things
19:29 < JonRob> ricky: thanks
19:29 < mmcgrath> well, in the present there's mostly a complete overlap between infrastructure and websites.  in the future it'd be nice for a more independant website team that just relies on infrastructure to do what it needs to do
19:30 < JonRob> mmcgrath: do you have thoughts on how this can be achieved? what specifically do we need to do?
19:30 < mmcgrath> I think it'll happen naturally as the websites team gains traction, starts doing more stuff, etc.
19:31 < ricky> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites/DomainsList
19:31 < JonRob> ricky: wow!
19:31 < giarc> wow!
19:31 < mmcgrath> I guess in theory y'all will do more stuff.  People will see that and come to you with more stuff to do.  You'll do even more stuff, etc, etc.
19:31 < giarc> thats a lot!
19:31  * giarc had no idea
19:32 < JonRob> mmcgrath: i agree, but does the websites team currently have everything in place that they need to just get stuff done?
19:32 < giarc> ah, redirects
19:32 < JonRob> is there new contributor documentation or practices that we need to put into place?
19:32 < mmcgrath> JonRob: yeah, I don't know if you guys all have access to the web repo and stuff but yeah.
19:32 < ricky> JonRob: Yes!
19:32 < mmcgrath> much of what you guys need to change isn't that difficult.
19:32 < JonRob> ok that's good to hear
19:33 < giarc> mmcgrath, CSS ?
19:33 < ricky> Right now, the build script isn't particularly usable - we need to do a lot to fix it.
19:33 < giarc> and markup, right ?
19:33 < giarc> or do we need to make $templates for all those domains?
19:33 < JonRob> well my thinking is, and this is my grand solution to everything, is that before the next meeting we could do with a list of tasks for this
19:33 < mmcgrath> <nod> and some things you guys will be able to fix automagically, other stuff will require someone from infra team to put it in place.
19:34 < JonRob> so that we can hit them one by one
19:34 < giarc> JonRob, +1
19:34 < giarc> to that
19:34 < JonRob> and get that warm fuzzy feeling from crossing off to-do list items :)
19:34 < giarc> right!
19:34 < giarc> easiest first..
19:34 < giarc> so the list shrinks real fast
19:34 < JonRob> or do people think there's more that can be done in the time frame before the next meeting?
19:34 < JonRob> giarc: yes!
19:35 < giarc> i think getting some of these domains looking better is a big enough task myself :)
19:35 < giarc> it has been sitting in our ticket system for ever
19:35 < giarc> and a day
19:35 < JonRob> giarc: we're getting to that bit :)
19:35 < giarc> and is immediately visible
19:36 -!- drago01 [n=linux chello062178124130 3 13 univie teleweb at] has quit "Verlassend"
19:36 < giarc> whereas spins or F10 work, is a fairly long way off in reality
19:36 < JonRob> can i get some feedback on the mission for the next meeting, and possibly somebody who'd like to do the leg work for it?
19:36  * ricky notes that theming tasks are easy picking.
19:36 < ricky> Just email the developers/checkout the code and edit the templates.
19:36 < ricky> For special stuff like docs.fp.o, though, it can be hard.
19:37 < giarc> JonRob, i'll start theming what i can
19:37 < ricky> Let us know if you need anything
19:37 < JonRob> giarc: ok :)
19:37 < giarc> it's not always that easy to actually find the parts you need tho :(
19:37 < giarc> ricky, ok
19:37 < ricky> Keep the list updated :-)
19:38 < giarc> that domain list is a big help :)
19:38 < JonRob> ricky - can i ask you to get us a list of things you think needs to happen for websites team to be able to "get stuff done"?
19:39 < ricky> JonRob: For fp.o, I think that making the buildscript friendlier/easier to work with is key.
19:39 < JonRob> ok...
19:39 < ricky> Do we have a task list on the wiki?
19:39 < JonRob> no, but i'll create one after this meeting
19:39 < ricky> I could add some items to the checklist before the next meeting
19:39 < JonRob> yeah that'd be good
19:39 < JonRob> i'll let the list know when i create the task list
19:39 < giarc> ricky, do we have an httpd.conf snippet for the getting the translations to work ?
19:40 < JonRob> and then we can reference those in future meetings
19:40 < giarc> or something similar?
19:40 < ricky> giarc: Yes, and make test in the fedoraproject.org directory will start an httpd with the correct config on localhost:5000
19:41 < giarc> ah, did not know that, thanks
19:41 < JonRob> the final point from the e-mail is the topic of content
19:41 < JonRob> but i'm willing to defer this until quaid and others are around
19:41 < giarc> JonRob, seems the best option
19:41  * JonRob notes the time is 12.45 am!
19:41 < giarc> to wait
19:42 < giarc> (for quaid and others :)
19:42 < JonRob> is everyone happy with the state of things? knows what the plan is for the coming week?
19:43  * giarc themes
19:43 < giarc> jaun spins :)
19:44 < giarc> ricky makes make a better neighbor
19:44 < giarc> s/make/makefile
19:44 < JonRob> it all sounds good to me
19:44 < JonRob> is there anything else anyone wanted to cover?
19:44 < JonRob> i'm sorry if i've cut some conversations a bit short tonight
19:44 < giarc> i wanted to note that i asked the art team to create a web banner:
19:45 < JonRob> giarc: oh yeah i saw that on list
19:45 < giarc> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Websites
19:45 < JonRob> another example of the art team rocking :)
19:45 < ricky> Yup :-)
19:45 < ricky> Hopefully, it'll carry over easily after the wiki migration
19:45 < giarc> they have made other options, and are willing to revise
19:45 < giarc> if we want
19:46 < giarc> i think it rocks as is
19:46 < giarc> nicu and rynaleach (sp?)
19:46 < giarc> and i think michael helped
19:46 < ianweller> ryanlerch
19:46 < ianweller> ;)
19:46 < giarc> thanks ianweller
19:46 < ianweller> speaking of wiki. https://publictest1.fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraMain -- anyone have anything they think should be in the sidebar on the left?
19:46 < JonRob> does anyone have any problems with the banner as is?
19:47 < giarc> i just wanted to bring it up, so we could talk about it
19:47 < giarc> if we wanted, otherwise, i am ready to tell them job well done and thanks!
19:47 < JonRob> i get the impression you can tell them job well done :)
19:48 < giarc> JonRob, :) me too
19:48 < giarc> lets be done ?
19:49 < JonRob> going to call the meeting finished in....
19:49 < JonRob> 3...
19:49 < JonRob> 2.....
19:49 < JonRob> 1.....
19:49 < JonRob> </meeting>
19:49 < mmcgrath> :)
19:49 < ricky> Thanks!

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